Is Toronto REALLY The Worst City For Men?

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So an article called 15 Reasons Why Toronto Is the Worst City In North America For Men by RooshV showed up on my Facebook on Monday. I’ve never meet RooshV, although I’ve had heard a lot about him from various people who have read his books, but to me the whole article just reads like someone who is looking for reasons to explain why he couldn’t get laid in this city. I personally don’t have anything against the guy though, and since a lot of bloggers and people out there have already bashed the hell out of the man, I’ve gonna leave the personal insults out of this and actually talk about something useful.

Toronto is a FANTASTIC city

From Spring to Fall there is something cool to do almost every weekend. Events like The Toronto Zombie Walk (where tens of thousands of zombies wander the streets of the city and then party down afterwards), FanExpo (the ultimate in comic book, sci-fi, horror, and other geeky awesomeness), Nuit Blanche (where everyone wanders the city all night, drinking and looking at crazy artwork all over the place), The Drum Circles (where hundreds of people hang out and play bongo drums, smoke weed, and dance around), Speakeasy Parties (where you can just show up at a random party to meet new people), The Festival of Beer (which pretty much explains itself) – the list goes on and on. There is always something cool going on for you to meet beautiful women at or bring dates to.

Not only that, but the live music and arts scene is truly incredible here. Whatever your musical or artistic pleasure is, you can probably find it happening pretty regularly in Toronto. And concerts! So many concerts and so many venues. I’ve almost completely checked off my list of “Rock Stars I Need to See Perform Live Before One Of Us Dies”. There are all sorts of dinner theatre places (like the Sultan’s Palace, where you eat while watching belly dancers perform around the room), and quirky little bars (like Snakes and Lattes, where you can play any of the HUNDREDS of board games while you drink). There is a thriving community for every subculture you can imagine: goths, hipsters, fetishists, D&D players – we’ve got them all! There are meet-ups and groups for every hobby, cause, or activity you can imagine. Whatever your interest is, there are a group of people in Toronto with that same interest and something coming up in the city that you can go check out.

Now, RooshV complains that there are too many Asian and Indian girls in Toronto, but I think that’s part of what makes Toronto so amazing. It is a fantastically multicultural city with an incredibly diverse population. As such, there are numerous districts all over the city, each with it’s own unique set of amazing foods to try, bars to drink at, and events to take part in. I would personally be bored in a predominantly white city with very few options for exploring new foods and cultural experiences.

There is so much potential for fun and excitement in Toronto I feel like if you’re bored or not having fun, you are doing something very wrong. This is a great city which provides incredible options at nearly every corner for trying new things, meeting beautiful women, and having fantastic adventures.

Now don’t get me wrong, I have also observed and commented on various threads on our forum that it seems more difficult to approach women in Toronto than in some of the other cities I’ve visited over the years. Johnny Soporno and I even had a discussion once about how Toronto is one of the hardest cities to meet women (up there with Amsterdam according to him). I can’t say that I agree with most of the things RooshV has listed in his article, but I do think that the actual problems he lists are easily avoidable. So for anyone else who’s finding it hard to approach beautiful women in Toronto, whether you live here or you’re just visiting, here are some tips for avoiding some of the issues RooshV thinks you may run into:

Girls cockblock more than anywhere else in the world and You have to be approved by the “mother hen”

I’m not sure if it’s necessarily true that it happens more in Toronto than anywhere else in the world, but my friends and I generally do deal with more far more interruptions and “cockblocking” attempts from protective friends than from guys (whether they know the girls or not) in general. But this isn’t necessarily a problem if you are opening groups of girls, merging them with your friends (or if you’re out alone, with another group of girls), and befriending everyone. This is what we call Group Theory and you can avoid both of these issues by befriending her friends before they can even become so-called cockblocks. Just opening a girls that appear to be alone at a bar or club generally limits your options in since very few women are found alone in these places. This is what Mystery refers to as the First Level of Game. The next level of game is when you start approaching groups and winning the friends over, and the third level is when you start merging groups with either groups you’ve already talked to, or hotter girls you WANT to talk to. You don’t have to ATTRACT their friends, you just have to show them that you’re a fun, non-needy guy that they can trust their friend’s safety with. If the “mother hen” taking all the chicks away, clearly you have failed to convey this.

Girls are more excited about getting late night food than having sex

This is slightly exaggerated, but also a little true. People love getting food after-hours in Toronto. There are now so many late-night food options like pizza, burger joints, diners, Chinese restaurants, and gourmet poutine (fries with gravy, cheese, and all sorts of bizarre combinations of toppings – my favourite is just adding LOTS of bacon).

Is this really a problem though? Maybe if you’re game plan is to try to pull the girl away from her friends and straight back to your place. But since we know girls can be protective of their friends and many women won’t sleep with a guy unless they feel they know him well enough, bouncing to grab some food after the bar/club is actually a pretty good idea. Going to multiple locations with your girl is something that helps build comfort because if she were to think back, she remembers the two of you hanging out at a number of different places and feeling safe and comfortable and having fun in each one. So if you think it’s pretty likely she’s not going to hop into a cab to your place, adjust your game plan and invite her and her friends to join you and your friends to grab some food after the bar. Sit down and get to know each other, let your friends say great things about you to her friends, and hopefully by then everyone will feel comfortable enough for you and your girl to head back to your place.

Ugly girls are desperate while attractive girls are inaccessible

I have personally found the opposite of this to be true. In Toronto, it seems like men approach the pretty, but not SMOKING HOT women far more than the really hot women. As such, the attractive-but-less-than-bombshell women have developed quite a lot of defence against the barrage of bore they have received from the same crappy, insecure, and insincere attempts to pick them up. But because the average guy is has been rejected so many times by the average pretty girl, they assume the truly stunning women will be even bigger bitches, so they’ll chicken out at the idea of opening them and facing a far worse rejection. As a result, my wings and I have found that the 9s and 10s in Toronto are far friendlier than 7s and 8s. If nothing else, most of the really attractive women I’ve met just seem to be happy to be approached by someone friendly and interesting and not like the typical macho douchebag that is the only kind of guy to work up the courage to approach the really hot girls.

I do agree that most of time you will see a 9 or 10 with dudes, but that doesn’t necessarily mean she’s “with” one of them. Maybe the guy is her brother, her coworker, or just a friend who is so deeply locked into orbit that he’ll never escape. So what if she’s with dudes, open them anyway and make some friends! Befriend the guys, AMOG them if they give you any attitude, and find out how everyone knows each other. Unless it’s obvious she and the dude are an item, approach the girl!

Girls Don’t Give Eye Contact

Ok so yeah, I have noticed that women in other cities make eyes at me far more than they do in Toronto. That doesn’t mean they never give eye contact. As I mentioned before, a lot of women in Toronto have been barraged by socially inept and creepy guys. So if you’re skulking around a club, hunting for a perfectly fit and available white women to try to convince to sleep with you, chances are pretty good that any women in that see you aren’t going to be looking to make eye contact, let alone talk to you!

What you should be doing is hanging out with your friends, having fun, laughing and having a great time. People in a club especially will physically gravitate toward the group that looks like they are having the most fun. Those are the people they will try to make eye contact with and want to start a conversation with. And really, if no one is noticing you amongst the hundreds or thousands of guys, then it may be time to spruce up that wardrobe a little!

The entrenched PUA culture is raising the egos of all women

Obviously I disagree with this, but I’m glad he saw how strong the PUA culture was in Toronto! The real reason the egos and defences of a lot of women are raised in Toronto is not the PUAs, but all the rest of the creepy, needy drunk guys who harass them, lose their minds and shout at them when they get rejected, and generally act like douchebags. Pickup Artists ultimately strive to be interesting, captivating individuals who understand the fears and anxieties of both men and women, and ensure the women who are with them feel comfortable and safe. Sure, when a lot of guys get into the game they are very miscalibrated and will sometimes do some weird, socially awkward, annoying, or embarrassing things. But unlike your typical Average Frustrated Chump, a PUA learns from his mistakes, improves his approach, and doesn’t go out and do that same shit again the next night.

Last call is at 2am

This is certainly true, and it sucks big time. Sadly, most of the after-hours venues in Toronto are sketchy, coke-filled, sausage-fests, so once you hit 2am there really aren’t many options for drinking and meeting people. And I certainly wouldn’t try to bring any girls to any of those places, so unless someone out there knows a spot that I don’t (in which case, send me a message!), after-hours in Toronto are a waste of time and money.

However, given that we know people in Toronto are crazy about late-night food and that most people still want a drink after the club, there are a couple ways to make this problem work in your favour:

1. Bounce girls to get some food. Again, this will give you more time build a connection, get to know her, and hopefully set things up for bouncing back to your place after. Poutine and pizza are always winners, and some late-night Chinese restaurants near Spadina and Dundas will serve you beer in a tea pot after last call if you are sober enough to ask quietly for “cold tea”.

2. If you don’t have girls to bounce with, go somewhere that you know will have a lot of groups of girls getting food and get an extra couple of approaches in. I’ve met all sorts of interesting women standing in line at a packed poutine place. Even if you still can’t pull anyone at least you got some extra practice! Really late sets can be fun to because you can get away with a little more, so use that time to try out some outlandish stuff you’ve always wanted to try!

3. Be the after party! Like I said, a lot of people want to keep partying after 2am, just invite the set back to your place for some drinks. Have some booze, mix, and snacks and bring the girls (and any girls your wings have with them) back to your place for the “official after party”.

Oh, and it happens to be Canadian Music Week up here and on occasions like this a number of times a year, last call gets pushed back to 4am. BOOYAH!

If you make just one mistake with a Toronto girl, you will be rejected

Listen, I have gotten away with saying some ridiculous things to women. But I always come from a frame of having fun and playing around. I never take these things seriously. If I make a lame joke and the girl calls me out on it I’m not going to get insulted and let it bruise my ego, I’m going to smile at her and joke that she just doesn’t get the depth of my humour and then tell an even sillier joke as if I was making some sort of important philosophical statement. Why? Because -I- would find that funny and I’m just out at the bar having fun.

Are there better cities out there than Toronto, most definitely. Is it the WORST CITY IN NORTH AMERICA for men? Hardly. Toronto CAN be a difficult city for approaching women, but it’s certainly not as bad as RooshV makes it out to be. Yes, women are a little more on the defensive. But that just means that you need to be less CREEPY when you approach them. It’s not their fault that they’ve been approached by hundreds of assholes. And it’s not their fault that your approach was pretty much the same as the last asshole she had to get away from her – that’s your fault. If your approach reeks of creepy douchebag who’s just trying to get laid, that’s something you should probably spend some time fixing instead of bitching about how stuck-up Toronto girls are.

And hey, if this really is the most difficult city to meet women in, then once you get these problems solved the rest of the world will seem easy!

Happy sarging,


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6 Responses to "Is Toronto REALLY The Worst City For Men?"
  1. Derail says:

    Awesome job Prophet!!!!

  2. SmoothDoc says:

    Hey Prophet did not know you were blogging man. Good article, and Amsterdam isn’t that bad for “vrouwen versieren” as we say in Dutch.

    Johnny gets a second chance here in May so maybe it goes better with picking up this time.

  3. Socialkenny says:

    I’ve never been to Toronto but I think Roosh’s article was over the top somewhat.

  4. Anon Coward says:

    It seemed like you agreed with him more than not.

    So which big cities are worse than Toronto?

  5. Prophet says:

    Well, I agreed that some of the issues he mentions do exist in Toronto, but they are certainly not a debilitating as he makes them out to be. Plus, the few issues that I’ve seen myself are easily avoidable with an understanding of group theory, which is part of the foundation of what we teach, or just a basic understanding of female psychology.

  6. jigsaw says:

    Personally, I think Roosh is just plain sexist!,

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