I got LJBF'd... I really need advice
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  1. #1
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    Guys, this is a somewhat lengthy post, but I feel fucking terrible and need some help with this. lots of threads i make dont get advice for them, but i need help here.

    Ok wow I did not see this one coming at all. So I made a couple posts about this girl before, but I might as well recap what I said before first.

    I met her at a party last Friday and there was instant attraction, qualification went well, commonalities rose up from everywhere, time bridge, number close, it all went well. We got along so great that I would've never expected an LJBF.

    So I texted her on Tuesday to see if she wanted to go to a hockey game, I had an extra ticket (our time bridge was for a later date). She sounded really excited and into it, so i figured it was an IOI. I pick her up, and my car is kinda dumpy but I acted perfectly ok with it joking around when it was being weird. Convo was going well etc.

    We got there, and before the game I saw some people I knew, they seemed happy to see me, I introduced her... then went to seats. We have season tickets to this team and so my uncle was sitting with us, and my cousin, I figured it was no big deal cause we would just go meet up with my friends after the first period anyway (The way I saw it was, I'm doing this, she should come along. Isn't that the right idea for a day 2?). The game was entertaining for the first period, I managed to tease her a bit with some kino on her arm and shoulder.

    We went to go meet up with my friends after the first period. On the way to meet my friends I saw some girls I knew, and they hugged me hello and were happy to see me (preselection) so i introduced her to them. We met up with my friends, I introduced my friend as one of the best guys I know, he had his girlfriend with him (preselection for him is kind of like preselection for me, or so ive heard) and two of my other afc friends were there.

    For the rest of the game I did some kino on her arm, leg etc. I ran out of things to say but she still had positive BL toward me. After the game (we lost 6-2 god damnit) we went to my friends house... this sucked. They ended up getting stoned and me and her just sat there doing nothing. I figured this was a big DLV but...

    I drove her home after and she said she had a good time etc. and i figured she wasnt interested anymore, i wasnt seeing any IOIs really so i didnt go for a kiss. Instead SHE came in for the kiss, caught me by surprise, but im not sure if she tried to kiss my cheek? it was weird.

    Anyway before she left she invited me to a movie for the next night (tonight), so i figured things were going good but i wasnt sure, i wasnt seeing the positive BL..

    So to eliminate my doubts, i decide to text her as if to frame it that we are going together. "Will you be ready by 830 for me to pick you up?" She answered ten minutes later with "im actually meeting a friend for coffee before." I think fuck. before i text her back she says "you should come with us!" This seemed like a big IOI to me so i figured i was really in it again. I met her friends, one of them i actually knew from before and she loved me so that was good. I got along with them well so i thought things were going good.

    We walk to the movie, and i sit beside her for the movie. I know a movie isnt a great date but she invited me. We were a bit early so we talked for a bit but I couldnt think of anything to say for a lot of it... its a big issue of mine. About 5 mins into the movie i try to hold her hand. she doesnt resist, but when i squeeze her hand she doesn't squeeze back. She was limp in my hand, unresponsive defining IOD in my opinion. To exit that, i pretend i got a text and let go, and that was that for the movie.

    When i drive her home at the end she says she doesnt want to lead me on etc. This was a crushing blow to me. I saw it coming from what happened at the movie but not before that, iois everywhere...

    This hurts a lot. I really clicked with this girl when i met her, thought she would be an LTR. Seriously guys i need some help with this one, what i did wrong, if there is still a chance cause i feel shitty and must have been blind throughout all of it or something...

    I tried kino. Maybe she didnt know that it was supposed to be a date thing... but why did she try to kiss me? unless it was supposed to be a friendly on the cheek thing? WTF this is fucking with my head help me out guys. If her IOIs were that of a friendly interest, i guess i didnt kino enough?? This is the big thing that I want to know, how i couldve made her know im interested as a relationship and not friendship.

    Some other important points:
    -I invited her to my friends valentines day party on saturday and she said she would like to go. After the terrible time at my friends house, when my friend asked her if she would come she said she could maybe make it.
    -She wants to follow through with our initial time bridge that was also with some other people.
    -I did DLV myself sometimes: I don't know a lot of music and that was apparent when music at the hockey game went on, and I DONT KNOW WHY but i kept saying how i dont know the artist to this song etc. Another DLV is that i said i saw her friend but didnt recognize her, because im terrible with remembering faces. This wouldnt be a bad DLV i dont think, but another instance came up with this and i really emphasized it for some reason that i dont even know...

    I know this is oneitis but i have been around a lot of women and i really noticed her, im sure some of you understand.


  2. #2
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    Sounds like you're moving pretty fast with her. Here's a useful tip: Until you f-close her, every time you separate from each other restart the M3 model before moving on to the next stage.

    That means if you're meeting up for a Day 2, don't go straight into Comfort. Go back to being cocky funny, disqualify yourself/neg her and DHV a bit. You're not STARTING OVER, you're just REMINDING HER of why she's attracted to you in the first place. So instead of just holding her hand, throw it away first, say something like, "Eewww your hand is all sweaty!" and then grab it again a minute later and give it a squeeze.

    Also, really work on disqualifying yourself and playing hard to get. Some examples:
    So I texted her on Tuesday to see if she wanted to go to a hockey game, I had an extra ticket (our time bridge was for a later date). She sounded really excited and into it, so i figured it was an IOI.
    You: Okay, you can come to the game but I better hear you screaming and cheering for my team!

    "Will you be ready by 830 for me to pick you up?"
    What you could've said: "Be ready for 8.30, and wear something sexy!"

    "you should come with us!"
    You: "Hmm... I dunno. I really don't like coffee. Can I bring a flask?"

    They're ballsy, cocky, stupid answers. But they're funny, and show you're a challenge! I'm realizing more and more that C/F is the only way to go. Ross Jeffries, David Wygant, David DeAngelo, ("Hank Moody" from Californication ).... These are the "naturals" who don't rely on routines or tricks or anything else to attract a girl. They simply know how to be funny, disqualify themselves, and maintain great body language.


  3. #3
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Rambo View Post
    Guys, this is a somewhat lengthy post, but I feel fucking terrible and need some help with this. lots of threads i make dont get advice for them, but i need help here.

    Ok wow I did not see this one coming at all. So I made a couple posts about this girl before, but I might as well recap what I said before first.

    I met her at a party last Friday and there was instant attraction, qualification went well, commonalities rose up from everywhere, time bridge, number close, it all went well. We got along so great that I would've never expected an LJBF.

    So I texted her on Tuesday to see if she wanted to go to a hockey game, I had an extra ticket (our time bridge was for a later date). She sounded really excited and into it, so i figured it was an IOI. I pick her up, and my car is kinda dumpy but I acted perfectly ok with it joking around when it was being weird. Convo was going well etc.

    We got there, and before the game I saw some people I knew, they seemed happy to see me, I introduced her... then went to seats. We have season tickets to this team and so my uncle was sitting with us, and my cousin, I figured it was no big deal cause we would just go meet up with my friends after the first period anyway (The way I saw it was, I'm doing this, she should come along. Isn't that the right idea for a day 2?). The game was entertaining for the first period, I managed to tease her a bit with some kino on her arm and shoulder.

    We went to go meet up with my friends after the first period. On the way to meet my friends I saw some girls I knew, and they hugged me hello and were happy to see me (preselection) so i introduced her to them. We met up with my friends, I introduced my friend as one of the best guys I know, he had his girlfriend with him (preselection for him is kind of like preselection for me, or so ive heard) and two of my other afc friends were there.

    For the rest of the game I did some kino on her arm, leg etc. I ran out of things to say but she still had positive BL toward me. After the game (we lost 6-2 god damnit) we went to my friends house... this sucked. They ended up getting stoned and me and her just sat there doing nothing. I figured this was a big DLV but...

    I drove her home after and she said she had a good time etc. and i figured she wasnt interested anymore, i wasnt seeing any IOIs really so i didnt go for a kiss. Instead SHE came in for the kiss, caught me by surprise, but im not sure if she tried to kiss my cheek? it was weird.

    Anyway before she left she invited me to a movie for the next night (tonight), so i figured things were going good but i wasnt sure, i wasnt seeing the positive BL..

    So to eliminate my doubts, i decide to text her as if to frame it that we are going together. "Will you be ready by 830 for me to pick you up?" She answered ten minutes later with "im actually meeting a friend for coffee before." I think fuck. before i text her back she says "you should come with us!" This seemed like a big IOI to me so i figured i was really in it again. I met her friends, one of them i actually knew from before and she loved me so that was good. I got along with them well so i thought things were going good.

    We walk to the movie, and i sit beside her for the movie. I know a movie isnt a great date but she invited me. We were a bit early so we talked for a bit but I couldnt think of anything to say for a lot of it... its a big issue of mine. About 5 mins into the movie i try to hold her hand. she doesnt resist, but when i squeeze her hand she doesn't squeeze back. She was limp in my hand, unresponsive defining IOD in my opinion. To exit that, i pretend i got a text and let go, and that was that for the movie.

    When i drive her home at the end she says she doesnt want to lead me on etc. This was a crushing blow to me. I saw it coming from what happened at the movie but not before that, iois everywhere...

    This hurts a lot. I really clicked with this girl when i met her, thought she would be an LTR. Seriously guys i need some help with this one, what i did wrong, if there is still a chance cause i feel shitty and must have been blind throughout all of it or something...

    I tried kino. Maybe she didnt know that it was supposed to be a date thing... but why did she try to kiss me? unless it was supposed to be a friendly on the cheek thing? WTF this is fucking with my head help me out guys. If her IOIs were that of a friendly interest, i guess i didnt kino enough?? This is the big thing that I want to know, how i couldve made her know im interested as a relationship and not friendship.

    Some other important points:
    -I invited her to my friends valentines day party on saturday and she said she would like to go. After the terrible time at my friends house, when my friend asked her if she would come she said she could maybe make it.
    -She wants to follow through with our initial time bridge that was also with some other people.
    -I did DLV myself sometimes: I don't know a lot of music and that was apparent when music at the hockey game went on, and I DONT KNOW WHY but i kept saying how i dont know the artist to this song etc. Another DLV is that i said i saw her friend but didnt recognize her, because im terrible with remembering faces. This wouldnt be a bad DLV i dont think, but another instance came up with this and i really emphasized it for some reason that i dont even know...

    I know this is oneitis but i have been around a lot of women and i really noticed her, im sure some of you understand.
    Before I answer your question, I would like to know:

    -How sure are you that she really did feel qualified afterwards?

    -Did you give her mixed signals of interest and disinterest?

    -Okay, okay... if you are sure that you've qualified her, did you move try to build rapport or did you keep busting her balls afterwards? (Very very bad move)

    -Hmmm... considering that she didn't squeeze back with the hand test, maybe she really was not that into you in the first place. Maybe you should've generated more DHVs. The four most important IOIs to consider are:

    1. She reinitiates conversation when you shut up.
    2. She giggles for no fucking reason.
    3. She gets all touchy-feely towards you.
    4. She tries to get rapport and build comfort with you.

    -I'm willing to bet that the main problem with this sarge is the dissipation of attraction...


  4. #4
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    -How sure are you that she really did feel qualified afterwards?
    Well it went like this. We were in a group of four or so talking about some world issues i dont remember what, but she had an intelligent way to depict her point of view, and i was genuinely impressed. When the other people in the set left, she stayed to talk with me when I said something like "you seem really intelligent. Most girls I meet are really ditsy and hard to connect with, but you're different, i like that."

    Thats not word for word what i said, but she smiled and seemed happy about it, although im not sure if she actually felt qualified but we were told to leave where we were talking and join the party by the girl who owned the house (she was jealous haha). shortly after my target tried to isolate me and as we were walking to the couch some people insisted we play cards with them and i said ok.. :/

    -Okay, okay... if you are sure that you've qualified her, did you move try to build rapport or did you keep busting her balls afterwards? (Very very bad move)
    after cards i went to another group of people to appear unneedy, later though i gamed her in comfort. Rather i didnt have to game it just kinda naturally happened, we had a lot in common and stuff.

    -Did you give her mixed signals of interest and disinterest?
    well at the start i used an opener on my buddy "who would win in a fight, spiderman or batman?" and then i merged our set with my targets to get her opinion, and i "disapproved" of her opinion. i dont know if that counts as disinterest. HOWEVER she didnt seem to realize i was teasing and thought i was just being rude so i had to say "im only teasing" so i dont know if that negates the neg or not.

    -Hmmm... considering that she didn't squeeze back with the hand test, maybe she really was not that into you in the first place. Maybe you should've generated more DHVs.
    I saw iois everywhere like they were going out of style, but they werent the best ones all the time. I had where she would reinitiate conversation, and she would giggle at my bad jokes but not where she would giggle for no reason at all. She tried to get rapport and build comfort with me but maybe only because i tried to do that with her, and it wasnt deep comfort.

    3. She gets all touchy-feely towards you.
    I never had this happen with her. The closest thing to her initiating kino with me was at the hockey game where she shook my hand at some deal she proposed we make (i help her learn about hockey and she helps me learn about theatre which she is active in), and a high five when i guessed the artist to a song correct.

    -I'm willing to bet that the main problem with this sarge is the dissipation of attraction...
    im thinking either that, or i didnt make it seem like i was interested in her for a relationship. I dont know how the attraction went away.. I had preselection everywhere for girls i know loving me, and her friends loving me and my friend having his girlfriend with him, and some stories i told with girls in them with me... i had social proof with people i saw at the hockey game really happy to see me (normally they arent THAT happy, but ill take it haha) and my friends really being respectful to me.

    The way i see it, is there were a lot of iois through her texting and her weird cheek kiss thing but maybe they were those of friendly iois, not of sexual interest.

    Sounds like you're moving pretty fast with her. Here's a useful tip: Until you f-close her, every time you separate from each other restart the M3 model before moving on to the next stage.
    This is amazing advice, wouldve been awesome to know before!

    Thanks guys! Any more advice would be extremely appreciated. I notice that as it makes more sense to me i start to feel better, weird huh?


  5. #5
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    Personally I think this is a case of WAY TOO MUCH GAME. I understand you're learning the M3 model and everything that goes with it but at some point you need to let it go and stop seeing things in terms of stages and IOI's/IOD's. You're totally screwing yourself up by wondering whether or not she's giving you IOI's and IOD's and it's getting in your head. From now on assume you're getting IOI's unless you notice clear IOD's. Don't even look for them. Just assume you're getting the IOI's and don't think about it.

    You also need to look into the whole unreactive concept. The M3 model is great when you first start out to understand the concepts of when to show disinterest, when to give interest and when to build comfort; but it fails to touch on the most important concept of game: unreactiveness. Do some more reading on this concept and start applying it where you can. You're looking at things in terms of steps, stages, IOI's/IOD's...what you need to start seeing is that it's all about the strength of your frame, the value you're offering and having unreactive emotions. Once you start getting reactive and needy the game is over. Hope that helps


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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    aint you that guy that s going to college? rambo

    its take a lot of time and effort to learn MM man , i would say 2 years at least to master the basics

    many had dropped out from college to learn game , man , i would say drop game dont drop college

    okay so about the girl , its seem like everything is going well for you , i dont see anything wrong with it , you are probably just mind fucking yourself up

    you built some attraction , got into lots and lots of comfort , and now its time to seduce her , hopefully that you didnt spent too much time on comfort so she LJBF you already

    great advantage : you drove her home , she is comfortable with you driving you home , you could totally isolate her from there .

    keep it light on valentine day , dont go i love you and i will die for you on the girl ass .keep it light. you are just building more and more comfort , get her to be comfortable with touching , kissing you more

    get her to feel comfortable going to seduction location . take her there once or twice so she doesnt get any ideas when you take her there to seduce her

    isolate isolate at all times , its time for one on one action . no more group tactics

    kiss her , she already kissed you so she is comfortable with it . but you probably freaked out because you werent that comfortable

    stop mindfucking your self . its going to be okay , shes not an one itis , just your game is probably still very weak

    if she LJBF you , everything going to be fine . you win sometimes , you lose sometimes , but you will always learn


  7. #7
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    many had dropped out from college to learn game , man , i would say drop game dont drop college
    Good advice. No worries dude college is my top priority, game is a side thing. School consumes a lot of my time but I love it at the same time haha. Because I don't get too much free time, my game progression is slow, plus I'm not old enough for bars yet so my practising options are hindered a bit.

    keep it light on valentine day , dont go i love you and i will die for you on the girl ass .keep it light. you are just building more and more comfort , get her to be comfortable with touching , kissing you more
    Hmm dude I think you missed that I posted this:
    When i drive her home at the end she says she doesnt want to lead me on etc.
    Unless you mean still try to game her..? Don't see how I would go about that

    From now on assume you're getting IOI's unless you notice clear IOD's
    Do you mean after A2? Are you saying jump into A3 even if I don't see IOIs? or that once i've been in comfort and am in a day 2 assume I'm getting IOIs?

    You also need to look into the whole unreactive concept.
    Hmm ok... But being unreactive to what? If she is sounding really excited to see me, don't return her excitement? Does this apply after I've been in comfort? I was fairly unreactive when she said LJBF but the game is over at that point, no?


  8. #8
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Rambo View Post

    Do you mean after A2? Are you saying jump into A3 even if I don't see IOIs? or that once i've been in comfort and am in a day 2 assume I'm getting IOIs?



    Hmm ok... But being unreactive to what? If she is sounding really excited to see me, don't return her excitement? Does this apply after I've been in comfort? I was fairly unreactive when she said LJBF but the game is over at that point, no?

    Again, you're thinking too much about the stages. Not matter what stage you're in assume you're getting IOI's in every part of the interaction unless you're getting clear IOD's. I don't know if you can see it but you're so in your head about what stage you're in and if you're getting IOI's or not that it's screwing up your calibration. When you're in your head like that you don't come off as "smooth"

    Unreactiveness should be a part of your everyday life. You should always be unreactive, it doesn't matter what stage of the M3 model you're in. Being unreactive doesn't mean been unexpressive or not having any energy. Being unreactive means you don't have emotional reactions to things. You don't constantly react to the girl or the situation. For example, lets say you called this girl up, left a voicemail and she didn't call you back. Would you have an emotional reaction to that? Or would you be unaffected and have a "no big deal" attitude? It's all about having no emotional reaction to the girl or the situation whatsover. The person that is reacting more than the other person is lower value. You want to be higher value so you want her to be the one reacting to you. Remember that men ACT, women REACT. At least thats how you want it. Here are some bullet points that might help you see things a bit different (taken from my notes):

    What are symptoms that someone is REACTING?
    1. Their natural personality is being affected by you
    2. The way they feel about themselves is tied up in your responses to them
    3. Their focus is more directed towards you than other people in the room
    4. They feel a heightened emotional response based on physical contact with you
    5. They analyze how they’re taking up your space and time (goes back to you should infringe on peoples space)

    What is Masculine Polarity
    1. Acting into and through only your own intentions
    2. Being entirely uncontrollable and above manipulation
    3. Dictating the reality around you rather than being affected by it
    4. Being in the moment and walking through the world with ease
    5. Having absolutely no intimidation of the girl or the world whatsoever
    6. Tapping into the energy inside you not around you as a source of your mood
    7. Feeling no spikes or lulls of self esteem from any girls responses to you


    What is she looking for: Decisiveness, Resourcefulness, Dominance, Fearlessness, Guy who dictates reality and does not have it dictated to him


    • Who is trying to impress who? The person that's trying to impress is the person thats lower value
    • Don’t let anything in your environment (eg a girl you like) affect your internal state, come from an abundance mindset and be unreactive
    • The next time you see her did you feel like it would be more her loss or more your loss if it didn’t work out?
    • Be non needy, come from a position of abundance with women
    • You never need something more than the other person
    • The lower value person in the interaction is trying to live up to the other persons standards and they’re having their identity dictated to them
    • Who is screening? Who is trying to impress?
    • Who is emotionally affected by the other persons acceptance? Who would feel no change?
    • Who is changing the way they act to try and get value from the other person? Who is being themselves? (who is reacting to who more)
    • Do things affect him? Does it cause him to react?
    • She responds to the un-stifled-ness in your voice





    Hope some of that helps you out! I know it can be confusing at first. I remember when I first came here a year ago and someone said to me "you need to be an unreactive high value male", I was thinking "what the fuck is this person talking about" LOL, but once you begin to understand the concept and start applying it to your life everything will change. Good luck


  9. #9
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    I remember when I first came here a year ago and someone said to me "you need to be an unreactive high value male", I was thinking "what the fuck is this person talking about" LOL,
    lol yeah that sounds about right. Thanks a bunch dude, I'll work on being unreactive more.


  10. #10
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    I got LJBF'd... I really need advice

    What products have you read/watched on game? I've found it's one thing to read what people say on a message board but where the real education comes from are the products offered by companies like VA and RSD.


    PS Riders suck, go bombers!! :P


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