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  1. #51
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    What pickup REALLY is

    That link doesn't work. I want statistics. I wanna run diagnostics on them. You haven't given me one legitimate number yet but I want them. So post where you got your information from. You keep telling me I'm wrong becuase you have logic and statistics. Give me the statistics and maybe i'll believe you.


  2. #52
    Nihilus Guest

    What pickup REALLY is

    Glad to see you admit you were wrong, you said it worked before ^^ As its already given,statistics are derived from numbers and written down and logicaly deduction from observation, the latter is used here.

    Though they can still show their insecurity in not following what they preached, such as "I am not going to reply anymore" and then they did. Post videos and sources for the ones I posted to be wrong and the statistics observed from observation and logic deducts that statisticly innergameguys have far higher failure rate. Until then, you are still replying though you can post statistics showing they arent, and see if that counteracts the statistics why they got such a huge failure rate.

    Though you are further appealing to emotions and not logic from the facts derived, but if you can prove it wrong with facts of your own, lets hear it


  3. #53
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    What pickup REALLY is

    I never said that link worked. Check your facts dude, you're wrong. Based on that even though you've been part of the conversation, everything you said could be wrong too. You're taking a philosophical view dude, based on "Well, what i percieve to be correct is correct".

    And WHAT THE FUCK is with mentioning RSD nation?I just had to look it up because until you mentioned it 3 billion times i had no idea what it was, and frankly the people there are horrid lol. However, I did find this. So do me a favor, track YOUR statistics for a month then get back to me:

    http://www.rsdnation.com/node/92613


    Though they can still show their insecurity in not following what they preached, such as "I am not going to reply anymore" and then they did.
    And you sent this in everyone of your last 3 messages on this post. Get a new routine, will ya? :P


  4. #54
    Nihilus Guest

    What pickup REALLY is

    Quote Originally Posted by Von_Halen View Post
    I never said that link worked. Check your facts dude, you're wrong. Based on that even though you've been part of the conversation, everything you said could be wrong too. You're taking a philosophical view dude, based on "Well, what i percieve to be correct is correct".

    And WHAT THE FUCK is with mentioning RSD nation?I just had to look it up because until you mentioned it 3 billion times i had no idea what it was, and frankly the people there are horrid lol. However, I did find this. So do me a favor, track YOUR statistics for a month then get back to me:

    http://www.rsdnation.com/node/92613




    And you sent this in everyone of your last 3 messages on this post. Get some new material, will ya?
    Then you admit to be wrong and that you still replied. You did post a field rapport based on their own experience, not the majority based and succes itself, that includes both video proof it it.
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...9967328566084#

    Based on deduction and the facts posted, it is facts until proven wrong.
    And its true, you are using the wishful thinking mentality, you couldnt even do something you said yourself would do
    Innergame further proves that its based on emotion, not logic. Though you are really getting angry again, calm down. If I tell you to calm down, its a simple enough task to do? if you cant follow your own instructions not to reply even though you said it, maybe you can do what others tell you to?

    One thing to wonder is that some has been converted from the whole hell hole, and instead use innergame in a more healthy and rational way, so its true that some can stop doing it, its still best to be sure they arent doing it for MONTHS with a gigantic failure rate.


  5. #55
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    What pickup REALLY is

    So track your own progress and get back to me. I found some statistics. Here's my arguement, now give me yours (This is from the ABC's of Attraction Forums):


    Learning Game is an approach to increasing your statistical probabilities of getting laid ultimately speaking.

    Let’s be conservative and say many coaches claim to have done over 5000 approaches(some 10,000) with 100-HB8+ lays, for a newbie think about the percentage of success over the 5000 approaches. This amounts to only a 2% lay rate over the course of one’s pick up endeavor. Still one could consider himself a master pick up artist with over 100+ lays in the span of 6 years. A newbie or intermediate must not take any rejection or flake too personally because with a 98% flake rate, you could possibly in theory have 100 number flakes in a row – still this may not mean your system or method sucks it was just pure chance that you got 100 number flakes in a row with no lays. Looking for the magic pill isn’t going to work – most newbie’s come to pickup with an approach of learning the magic line to not get rejected. This is futile because getting flakes/rejections is part of the parcel. One could argue you have to be rather hard headed or emotionally stubborn to make this journey work in your favor.


    It’s rather difficult to compare successful methods in the game of pick up. Unlike blackjack, poker or stock trading we can’t use simulating computer programs to guess the effectiveness of a particular pick up line or DHV story in a bar or club environment. In poker and stock trading we can systematically test our ideas and use Monte Carlos simulations via the personal computer to retrieve accurate statistics of our approach. The good poker operator knows even with a 95% chance of winning with his pocket aces he could still lose. Even if you’re sure confident you had 90% chance of laying that girl you still might be wrong - Be open to that idea. The complexity of the field is difficult to study one minute you may have had the perfect chance to approach and escalate and the following minute due to hesitation your chances may decease to 0% because a more experienced alpha male has opened the set.

    I have an interesting video for readers to watch and think about. http://<iframe class="restrain" titl...="0"></iframe> – Paul Janka of NYC claims to have a lay rate of roughly 11% so think 100approaches and scoring 11 lays with a developed method this would be considered incredible. He uses a spreadsheet to track his statistics. But in his overall career until that point he has proclaimed to have made over 10,000 approaches with 132 total lays this equates to only 1.32% overall lay rate.

    Personally speaking if you had a developed game plan with a confident approach like what we teach here at ABC’s and you earn yourself a 5% lay rate you would be an extraordinary pick up artist – fuck what the gurus have you think with their aura of invincibility. In one boot camp weekend it is easily possible to achieve over 60 approaches, 20 per night over 3 nights. How much could you achieve if you were more emotionally stubborn over a period of 6 years of practicing this art? One would accumulate thousands of approaches and thousands of reactions think more exposure more likelihood of success.

    Many newbie’s tend to blame themselves or their looks and race. It might have just been variable chance that you got rejected 20 times in a row remember 5% lay rate? 95% flakes for the good looking professionals that people envy so much. So despite their good looks and confidence they will suffer many strings of rejections just like a newbie – so please don’t be hard on yourself, none of the gurus are gods.

    That’s not to say we can’t increase our odds and have confidence in what we practice. Learning pick up lines, routines, DHV stories, sexual techniques and dressing better definitely increase our odds of laying the opposite sex. JT had 2 lays over here in Sydney in just one week, one in the club toilets and one with the hotel waitress. His situation is different, he has maxed his odds out by dressing edgy, learning better lines, having more exposure, having previous experience etc. The master operator knows when the time is right, but to get to this point and mental accuracy we need to have more exposure to success and failure and learning from all experiences.

    Here’s a good quote from Neil Strauss author of ‘the game’.

    ‘Dedicated to the thousands of people I talked to in bars, clubs, malls, airports, grocery stores, subways and elevators over the last two years. If you are reading this, I want you to know what I wasn’t running game on you. I was being sincere. Really, you were different.’

    Now, when you read the book did you realize Neil Strauss didn’t publish every interaction he had over the past 2 years? He couldn’t possibly. He only wrote about his successful pickups, which isnt a great deal when comparing approach:lay ratio. I think that’s really plays into the regular persons mind. You hear about all these gurus having great success but remember the lay rate percentage? There’s no logic in elevating a guru to deity status based on his writings. So when a community guru tries to crack himself up as a god its bull shit =] if you’re not mentally retarded and can comprehend what I’m expressing I believe we can all achieve 5% lay rate over the long term.


  6. #56
    Nihilus Guest

    What pickup REALLY is

    Quote Originally Posted by Von_Halen View Post
    So track your own progress and get back to me. I found some statistics. Here's my arguement, now give me yours (This is from the ABC's of Attraction Forums):


    Learning Game is an approach to increasing your statistical probabilities of getting laid ultimately speaking.

    Letís be conservative and say many coaches claim to have done over 5000 approaches(some 10,000) with 100-HB8+ lays, for a newbie think about the percentage of success over the 5000 approaches. This amounts to only a 2% lay rate over the course of oneís pick up endeavor. Still one could consider himself a master pick up artist with over 100+ lays in the span of 6 years. A newbie or intermediate must not take any rejection or flake too personally because with a 98% flake rate, you could possibly in theory have 100 number flakes in a row Ė still this may not mean your system or method sucks it was just pure chance that you got 100 number flakes in a row with no lays. Looking for the magic pill isnít going to work Ė most newbieís come to pickup with an approach of learning the magic line to not get rejected. This is futile because getting flakes/rejections is part of the parcel. One could argue you have to be rather hard headed or emotionally stubborn to make this journey work in your favor.


    Itís rather difficult to compare successful methods in the game of pick up. Unlike blackjack, poker or stock trading we canít use simulating computer programs to guess the effectiveness of a particular pick up line or DHV story in a bar or club environment. In poker and stock trading we can systematically test our ideas and use Monte Carlos simulations via the personal computer to retrieve accurate statistics of our approach. The good poker operator knows even with a 95% chance of winning with his pocket aces he could still lose. Even if youíre sure confident you had 90% chance of laying that girl you still might be wrong - Be open to that idea. The complexity of the field is difficult to study one minute you may have had the perfect chance to approach and escalate and the following minute due to hesitation your chances may decease to 0% because a more experienced alpha male has opened the set.

    I have an interesting video for readers to watch and think about. http://<iframe class="restrain" titl...="0"></iframe> Ė Paul Janka of NYC claims to have a lay rate of roughly 11% so think 100approaches and scoring 11 lays with a developed method this would be considered incredible. He uses a spreadsheet to track his statistics. But in his overall career until that point he has proclaimed to have made over 10,000 approaches with 132 total lays this equates to only 1.32% overall lay rate.

    Personally speaking if you had a developed game plan with a confident approach like what we teach here at ABCís and you earn yourself a 5% lay rate you would be an extraordinary pick up artist Ė fuck what the gurus have you think with their aura of invincibility. In one boot camp weekend it is easily possible to achieve over 60 approaches, 20 per night over 3 nights. How much could you achieve if you were more emotionally stubborn over a period of 6 years of practicing this art? One would accumulate thousands of approaches and thousands of reactions think more exposure more likelihood of success.

    Many newbieís tend to blame themselves or their looks and race. It might have just been variable chance that you got rejected 20 times in a row remember 5% lay rate? 95% flakes for the good looking professionals that people envy so much. So despite their good looks and confidence they will suffer many strings of rejections just like a newbie Ė so please donít be hard on yourself, none of the gurus are gods.

    Thatís not to say we canít increase our odds and have confidence in what we practice. Learning pick up lines, routines, DHV stories, sexual techniques and dressing better definitely increase our odds of laying the opposite sex. JT had 2 lays over here in Sydney in just one week, one in the club toilets and one with the hotel waitress. His situation is different, he has maxed his odds out by dressing edgy, learning better lines, having more exposure, having previous experience etc. The master operator knows when the time is right, but to get to this point and mental accuracy we need to have more exposure to success and failure and learning from all experiences.

    Hereís a good quote from Neil Strauss author of Ďthe gameí.

    ĎDedicated to the thousands of people I talked to in bars, clubs, malls, airports, grocery stores, subways and elevators over the last two years. If you are reading this, I want you to know what I wasnít running game on you. I was being sincere. Really, you were different.í

    Now, when you read the book did you realize Neil Strauss didnít publish every interaction he had over the past 2 years? He couldnít possibly. He only wrote about his successful pickups, which isnt a great deal when comparing approach:lay ratio. I think thatís really plays into the regular persons mind. You hear about all these gurus having great success but remember the lay rate percentage? Thereís no logic in elevating a guru to deity status based on his writings. So when a community guru tries to crack himself up as a god its bull shit =] if youíre not mentally retarded and can comprehend what Iím expressing I believe we can all achieve 5% lay rate over the long term.
    Then you are still replying again, which must mean you were wrong about your previous statement that you werent going to reply, unless you can say you lied or was wrong on it, but this time directly.

    Based on the deduction, if its true that the guys on lovesystems attraction forums have low successrate and the guys are using innergame, or worse, a bad bad bad version of MM because they dont understand it clearly, then it proves that PAUL with 10,000 approaches with 132 total lays this equates to only 1.32% overall lay rate. shows failure. He is a innergame guy primary in his approaches.


    You should evelate a style based on the students succes of both IOI and layrate. Since PAUL uses innergame then it just its incredible low % of success. Which proves that innergame is bad.

    The rsd nation and instructor pictures and steels students further proves this. Logic reason and deduction shall be used. Oh, and Paul with 10.00 and 132 lays when you look relatively handsome like this in the picture, then it definatly proves innergame has an incredible low amount compared to real MM routines material and tells you how much success you will have.

    And its true, innergame ONLY will not only have much less success, it will damage you in other areas of life, failing to do sources and facts like Tripp, or following emotions more strongly like von halen and not following what he just said he would not do. To much relying innergame will lead you to a internal insecurity which pops up and they get angry, which is the oposite of a healthy innergame.

    Basicly use outergame as its core, then use some innergame if you feel like shit. its simple. I am fine with it if people use it that way.


  7. #57
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    What pickup REALLY is

    This applies to all PUA's. That's including your GOD Mystery. I'm done with you man, I'd like to see things from your point of view but I can't get my head that far up my ass.

    So since I just GAVE you facts and you STILL think you're right even though you've given me ZERO statistical evidence, I've deduced that you are THE least confident person I've ever met in my life and you're trying to maintain what little value you have in yourself by needing to be right on this topic, when you clearly are not.

    That being said, I'm done. For real this time. I lied last time for the sake of arguement because I thought there'd be a chance of making some sense out of you, but that's clearly not going to happen especially because your grammar is absolutely horrid.

    I'm going to post this again on the main page because unlike you, some people are intelligent enough to see what I'm trying to say. I have a different style than you, and that's fine. So do us both a favor and don't comment on my new thread when it goes up.

    All the best, cheers.


  8. #58
    Nihilus Guest

    What pickup REALLY is

    Quote Originally Posted by Von_Halen View Post
    This applies to all PUA's. That's including your GOD Mystery. I'm done with you man, I'd like to see things from your point of view but I can't get my head that far up my ass.

    So since I just GAVE you facts and you STILL think you're right even though you've given me ZERO statistical evidence, I've deduced that you are THE least confident person I've ever met in my life and you're trying to maintain what little value you have in yourself by needing to be right on this topic, when you clearly are not.

    That being said, I'm done. For real this time. I lied last time for the sake of arguement because I thought there'd be a chance of making some sense out of you, but that's clearly not going to happen especially because your grammar is absolutely horrid.

    I'm going to post this again on the main page because unlike you, some people are intelligent enough to see what I'm trying to say. I have a different style than you, and that's fine. So do us both a favor and don't comment on my new thread when it goes up.

    All the best, cheers.
    Actually, it applies to those who fails. In this case, it applied to Paul, who was an exentive user of innergame, yet had a gigantic low success rate even while handsome. Just like RSD, just like steel, innergame not only statisticly, but video documentation, pictures facts, and of course facts like the suicide guy, proves its not enough. Though the facts in what you posted proved you wrong, you still seem to be using it. If its true I disagree with anyone be it on main page or on another forum ,anyone can disagree with it. Its still Euphism though. So you're grammar is the horrible one You lied and said you wouldnt post until "you dig deep in your body and start to come to terms with your insecurities," which means you contradicted yourself and proved yourself wrong. And it also means you simple lied in general, because of your emotional rationalization which is caused by fanatical innergame itself.

    It also proves that though the statistics and facts I posted, you still were wrong, that includes I later on took more fact based on what you yourself posted


  9. #59
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    What pickup REALLY is

    Quote Originally Posted by Nihilus View Post

    understand it clearly, then it proves that PAUL with 10,000 approaches with 132 total lays this equates to only 1.32% overall lay rate. shows failure.
    .
    I had told you before you reminded me some guys I knew. Now I am pretty sure you are one of these guys.

    Dude, a guy who got 132 lays, is not a failure, never ever, in no dictionary.

    One of these guys similar to you, I had to hang around back in days when I first started this. He would not approach, he would not do anything, I would approach 5 got 1 KC 1 NC , 3 nothing/reject , and he would see the situation as %60 failure. While he would always 0 approach 0 reject, he was always succesful.

    Dude, just leave the game, now. This stuff is not for you, or you ll be heavily disappointed. I think you got hyped with VH1 one show, Mystery's having girls hittin on him.


  10. #60
    Nihilus Guest

    What pickup REALLY is

    Quote Originally Posted by thesinnerma View Post
    I had told you before you reminded me some guys I knew. Now I am pretty sure you are one of these guys.

    Dude, a guy who got 132 lays, is not a failure, never ever, in no dictionary.

    One of these guys similar to you, I had to hang around back in days when I first started this. He would not approach, he would not do anything, I would approach 5 got 1 KC 1 NC , 3 nothing/reject , and he would see the situation as %60 failure. While he would always 0 approach 0 reject, he was always succesful.

    Dude, just leave the game, now. This stuff is not for you, or you ll be heavily disappointed. I think you got hyped with VH1 one show, Mystery's having girls hittin on him.
    Just like instructors having sex with 8 lays a year, or even 8 a year, thats not success. thats a gigantic failure its like the guy who had 70 lays in 10 years, that proves that innergame fails, because the failure rate is gigantic. a 1.32% overall lay rate that is not defined by people as a failure, those people are incredible emotional rationalizing. how many YEARS is 10.000 approaches? thats incredible low. Just like you got proven wrong by the facts of steel and RSD, it shows that you are appealing to consequences of the hype of innergame. You also showed cognitive dissonance when you also talked about not replying, yet did so again. Making excuses and ignoring the facts.

    Self-deception is a process of denying or rationalizing away the relevance, significance, or importance of opposing evidence and logical argument. Self-deception involves convincing oneself of a truth (or lack of truth) so that one does not reveal any self-knowledge of the deception.
    Just like the fact of the failed instructor of RSD, the guy who did suicide, that the majority of innergame guys, just like Paul, who was handsome, has incredible low success rate. though even though you got proven wrong with these facts and still doing it, then you are justifying and blaming others instead of actually changing and simple accept that innergame alone to game is not enough to get solid game. Thus your wishful thinking mental phase shows yet again.

    Other than that I really dont understand what your point is now, and dont want to argue more.
    Thus, like von halen, you did argue again. This is further proof not only that innergame makes you not able be bad at pick up as proven in the facts posted, it also makes you bad in other areas of your life, such as not being able to follow what you said you would. Thus, the documented proof of RSD instructors show you are like that, you are emotional rationalizing the wins, just like the student in the picture are rationalizing that she truly did get attracted! So unless you can get proof of this guy you know anymore then this guy who looked at the area51 or "whatever" as you said before, then he dont really exist and is not solid proof IF you already was proven wrong because you could look up simple fact such as that steel was a innergame guy.

    Jesus christ its just easy to google his name. Thats why you rely on emotions and fools gold, instead of logic and deduction of success rate. Pity the sinner, hate the sin.


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