Managing and maintaining MLTRs indefinately

[Johnny Soporno]

In case you haven't heard of me, or read any of my posts previously, or attended my Lifestyle-Coaching workshops or seminars, I'll mention a couple of things about myself:

I'm 38 years old, balding, heavy-set (think Tony Soprano in the early seasons) fellow who wears Hawaiian shirts most of the time... (see below!)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/102/310832923_f47cb25062.jpghttp://farm1.static.flickr.com/96/238238447_6fe36f4b03.jpg

I am also one of the most experienced and socially-mature Players in The Game. Despite my looks, not because of them, I do fantastically well with women of all cultures, styles, and idiosyncrasies... "I love the ladies, and they love me right back - now who's the Mack?" - Ice T

SO What is my secret? What is the special forumula which has facilitated my happy life?

I empower women to make their own choices.

For the last 15 years or so I have generally had a 'Primary' GF (with whom I would reside) and usually between three and maybe a half-dozen secondary gfs, in slow-rotation, plus an inestimable number of casual playmates, some of whom might join into the pusse (stet) from time to time.

To understand my situation, it is vital to recognize the distiction between TITLES (Capitalized) and roles (non-capitalized). The Primary is the one who bears the 'title' and role of GIRLFRIEND and may refer to me as her BOYFRIEND, whereas the secondaries all recognize that they can maintain the 'role' of girlfriend, and behave with me and towards me as their boyfriend, but that ours is not an overriding relationship.

I used to manage using what I called GITM rules (Gays In The Military - Don't ask, Don't tell) with my Primary, and the others would respect that they must keep things quiet; but it was always ultimately a losing proposition, because over time the girlfriends would want more, and eventually cattiness and discontent would tear my playhouse down.

About eight years or so ago I recognized the trouble-domain: I didn't want a harem!

I wouldn't have ONE wife, why in the world would I want many!?

So I vowed to myself I would no-longer permit women to live in denial about their rivals; but this made for very uncomfortable situations of nasty infighting, so it needed to be modified once again.

Finally I developed what I refer to as my TWO RULES: model, which has served me very well (incredibly well, actually) ever since the beginning of the Millenium.

For ALL the women in my life, from my Primary (with whom I live and share a bed in Toronto) to the girls I met and slept with last weekend in Chicago, whom I don't know if I'll see again before year's end, the TWO RULES are absolute, intractable, inflexable, and adamantine:

Rule One: I WILL BE NO WOMAN'S ONLY MALE LOVER!

Rule Two: Every girlfriend MUST COMMIT TO DO HER BEST to get along with my other girlfriends

These two, very simple, incredibly elegant pillars keep my home happy, my ladies ecstatic, and my sacs drained. ;)

A little more detail, in case the beauty of this is lost on anyone...

Regarding RULE ONE:

Every woman I am with knows IMMEDIATELY (because I tell her outright) that when I'm not with her, I'm with someone else.
Therefore, I need for her to understand that SHE WILL NOT EVER be entitled to unlimited, unrestricted, nor exclusive access to me, and as such she will need to find ways to keep herself amused when I am elsewhere.

No amount of 'But Baby, I only want to be with YOU!' will ever shake my resolve, as that situation is a SURE FIRE ROAD TO HELL, when the girl's resentment begins to perk-up and she becomes a green-eyed monster....

So, by insisting she has other male playmates, I remove A) her justification for being uptight with me when I'm unavailable to satisfy her cravings, and B) I ensure she continually expands her skillset and her expectations, thereby keeping me on my toes, and preventing my complacency.

Regarding RULE TWO:

Since every girl knows I'm getting around, just as they themselves are, and that there are 'others', they begin to realize there is no such thing as a 'rival' and that cattiness or ganging-up/bashing other girls in the circle won't help anyone, and will in fact necessitate their own removal from the otherwise very comfortable situation.

This second Rule guarantees a fundamentally harmonious and happiness-conducive lifestyle which has been working for me for the better part of a decade, and shows no signs of slowing down or breaking apart.


Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy

P.S. I exclusively date bisexual hotties and have been to bed with most of them with most of the rest of them, in some-or-other permutation.

[Harlequin]

Soporno is the living proof that you CAN please all of the people all of the time...

Providing the Primary GF gets on with the secondary... tertiary & um, twenty-thirdly.

There we were, a pair of laptop whores in an Amsterdam hotel room, me chatting to my girl, Soporno chatting to his legion of women... & with every one of the he stated that he would fill their colon with Spuzz... which they were fine with. I get to do that with Columbine only on Birthdays & Anniversaries... or when she's been a very bad girl, which luckily for me, is every day I'm with her.

Yeah, I'm a good influence.

[Johnny Soporno]

Wow! Thanks for this very well-phrased an in-depth series of questions, Ev!



In my situation, it is vital to recognize the distiction between TITLES (Capitalized) and roles (non-capitalized) the Primary is the one who bears the 'title' and role of Girlfriend and may refer to me as her Boyfriend, whereas the secondaries all recognize that they can maintain the 'role' of girlfriend and behave with me and towards me as their boyfriend, but that ours is not an overriding relationship.

Curious. How often do you change Primaries? Is it possible for a lower case girlfriend to become the upper case, and if so, how? What are the differences in benefits between the upper case and lower case girlfriends? I mean, what do I get/give from having the title that I wouldn't get/give as a role playing girlfriend? Is it solely a matter of geography, that is, the Primary being the one who's in the bed at home base?


I don't 'change' Primaries per se, but from time-to-time conditions arise which necessitate moving-on from one situation to the next, and generally by mutual consent my 'Most Signifigant Other' (aka Girlfriend-of-Record] and I opt to seperate to some degree.

Fundamentally this is a lot like a 'break up' usually because we've grown apart, become disenchanted, poorly-managed expectations, or perhaps even found someone else which compells a change-of-status.

I don't really have any EX Girlfriends or ex girlfriends, but merely girlfriends-in-remission, so to speak. They opt to disconnect for whatever reasons, knowing that I was always very honest and direct about everything with them; and that my door will always remain open for their return.

Normally, a secondary girlfriend isn't actually LOOKING for anything more 'heavy' than the relationship we have, and therefore isn't looking to 'trade-up' to Girlfriend Title and situation, but then it's also incorrect to describe their status as a 'role playing' thing; I am _A_ boyfriend of theirs, just as they are _A_ girlfriend of mine, and there's no complicated overhead.

The major difference between Primary and secondary roles is, as you suggested, that my Girlfriend would share be living with me, and we'd share a bed under normal circumstances. She would feel confident in introducing me to her family and business associates as Her Man, and would normally house most of all of her clothing in our shared closet, anticipate my returning to our shared Home each evening, unless explicitly expecting an agreed-to variation.

My Primary always maintains her own home, seperate from Ours, which we both contribute-to-upkeep on, so that if either of us wants to bring a 'date' someplace, we can have some privacy.



Rule One: I WILL BE NO WOMAN'S ONLY MALE LOVER!;

Rule Two: Every girlfriend MUST DO HER BEST to get along with my other girlfriends.


If I were to ignore your other girls, would that be acceptable to fulfill this requirement? I mean, if I were the Primary, would I have to take phone messages and actually, like, talk to them and occasionally break bread with them and stuff? Or is it enough to not want to have anything, positive or negative, to do with them? And is whining, "Goddamnit, Johnny, I wanted you home for Thanksgiving," a violation of this rule, or is a little of that acceptable so long as the complaint is centered on general dissatisfaction that you can't be everywhere at once, rather than deep resentment toward the other woman?


I never insist people DO get-along as friends, but I ALWAYS insist they not conspire nor act-out against oneanother, nor slag eachother to me or associated third-parties. (This is disharmonious and counter-productive, and in truth practically never takes place at all - the filters by which I decide upon my friends are very consistent, and tend to pre-qualify each new friend to my other friends.)
Once the notion of competitive rivalry is removed, the finest qualities of each person become obvious, and virtually all of my friends (be they lovers or platonic) tend to enjoy all my other friends.

Taking phone messages is moot, in that I have a service for that connected to my single telephone number (my cellular phone) and that is probably one of the best features of modern telecommunications (exclusive, individual access) because it reduces unnecessary friction.

Dining with, attending social events, etc, is always optional, but normally non-contentious - as long as people are grown-ups TRYING to get along, they usually do. I expect the people I invest my energy in and emotionally expose myself to to display fine maturity (hormonal-crises aside - I track all my gfs cycles in my blackberry's calendar, and set warning-alarms to manage unpredictable mood-swings) and I have rarely been disappointed.



Every woman I am with knows IMMEDIATELY (because I tell her outright) that when I'm not with her, I'm with someone else. Therefore, I need for her to understand that SHE WILL NOT EVER be entitled to unlimited, unrestricted, nor exclusive access to me, and as such she will need to find ways to keep herself amused when I am elsewhere.

Well, that's simple. On paper. Isn't the real problem the scheduling, however? Yes, I can live without unlimited or exclusive access to you, hon, but we need to sit down and plan out your schedule. Do we both agree that two hours with that whore... er, sorry, I mean your secondary girl in Council Bluffs on Thursday is enough this week, and I should get an hour and a half that evening? No? Okay, how about an hour then? I guess what I'm asking here is whether you mutually plan with your Primary or it's just up to her to be satisfied to expect you when she sees you. Because if it's the former, that sounds like more work than marriage. And if it's the latter, well, quite frankly, I think she's making too big of a concession.


My Primary is JUST THAT: first-called and first-considered. She's the girl I'm IN LOVE with, in the classic sense, and she is coincidentally in love with me; otherwise we would move on...
So if I have someone else I'd like to meet up with, I coordinate our BOTH having something else to do to at that time, and we determing where we'll be (so either of us can use the shared Home, or conversely 'Her pace' or wherever...)




So, by insisting she has other male playmates, I remove A) her justification for being uptight with me when I'm unavailable to satisfy her cravings, and B) I ensure she continually expands her skillset and her expectations, thereby keeping me on my toes, and preventing my complacency.

Wow, a million questions here, but I'll limit myself. Like, is it conceivable for you to ever be your Primary's Secondary? Would you be okay with that? Or must you always be your Primary's Primary? If so, you really need to add another Rule.

If a Primary is truly Polyamorous, I could handle being a co-Primary for her, otherwise the disparity won't stand.

My 'Two Rules' apply equally to my Primary as to any other woman I date;
however there are understandings held between myself and my Girlfriend which are specific to that relationship.


Also, what relationship do you maintain with your Primary's Secondaries? Do you have to live by your own Rule 2 that way? Take messages from them and stuff? Work out a schedule that allows your Primary to have time with you but also fit in her Secondaries as she desires?


Of course. Sauce for the goose is sauce for the Gander.

To be frank, I'm also more-than-happy to satisfy multiple-male partner fantasies for my lovers, providing there's no expectation of my sexually interacting with the other men. My explicit request is, if they wish for me to double-penetrate them with another fellow, he ALSO much shave his scrotum, to avoid that nastry Velcro(tm) hook'n'loop affect when we disconnect. Ouchie!
;)

Hope this gives you some context, and helps everyone to see that having a respectful, non-judgemental, non-possesive, sex-positive philosophy can be the secret to a life of hedonistic debauchery without heartbreak!

Best of luck!

Johny Soporno
Lover to Many
Married to None

[Top gun]

A simple question: How do you explain this and they don't get mad???

Don't say you need a great inner game. What is the environnement this kind of thing and when???

[Solitaire]

Umm...I told my main girl this after sex for the first time (day 2)

It's been 2 weeks, and so far no friction as to the other girls thing....she doesn't get catty, leave items at my place for others to find, or check my phone, email etc.

You want to lay the groundwork for this before too long, or else she is going to think your exclusive with her...so withing the first few times after having sex/meeting up.

Btw Johnny, thanks for your advice....It's help greatly in my relationship management!

[Yang]

This clears up a question that I had in the first place. Thanks to Soporno for the insight.

I have been runing into problems for the past week! My "primary" is feeling very scared, she says:

How can I have feelings for other girls while expecting her to believe that what I share with her is unique?

I have held my posicion and told her that she too must make a decision, I am tyred of fighting and whilst I really care about her, if she is better of without me then we must separate... I am really starting to believe this.

To keep this short, I guess I was having trouble conversing with her about this with her because I was not sure myself about how to work the relationship and waht limits to put forward (it is probably late to encourge her to "get along" with my dates.

In any case> Jonny, can you elaborate on how you maintain such a strong frame, what are your thoughts and feelings about the primary and other girls.
Do you validate any of their concerns?

Perhaps this is just so new to me that I am having trouble understanding it.

[Couture]

My explicit request is, if they wish for me to double-penetrate them with another fellow, he ALSO much shave his scrotum, to avoid that nastry Velcro(tm) hook'n'loop affect when we disconnect. Ouchie!

Worst mental image I have had in quite sometime..

But I have a Q for you Johnny...Have you ever been hanging out on a wednesday night with your shirt off watching reruns of Friends on the teevee and your main girlfriend comes out of the bathroom done up with the announcement of her going out with her other lover Joe Schmoe? Please explain what happens here.

[Johnny Soporno]

I have a Q for you Johnny...Have you ever been hanging out on a wednesday night with your shirt off watching reruns of Friends on the teevee and your main girlfriend comes out of the bathroom done up with the announcement of her going out with her other lover Joe Schmoe? Please explain what happens here.

First off, I haven't had a television since the late '80s, so that situation is moot; but presuming you mean to say "Your primary surprises you with an announcement she's going out with "Named Fellow"" then I might mention that I'd appreciate a little more advanced-notice next time, but to have a great time, and to please mention to Joe that someone gave me a pair of tickets to a ballgame next week while we're out of time, if he'd like to go? (After all, if he's worthy-enough to keep company with my Primary, AND he's got a NAME, he's got to be someone I'd respect and most-likely befriend.)

More often I'd expect a situation like this:

"Johnny, do you have anything in mind for us this Wednesday evening? If not, I'm going to be heading out on my own." That would not require the obvious completion [to get laid] because I'd presume it.

Honestly I can't relate to having a night like you've described, where I couldn't find anything to do with my time so I was slaughtering it helplessly like that... but if I were in that state, I certainly wouldn't want to inflict it on anyone else! Least of all, somebody I love!

Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy

[Couture]

Johnny, would it be fair to say that you are a swinger?

I can´t say I am down for that kind of reality you live - at heart I am probably too insecure.

I have this unending desire to be the king of my own castle. If one of the local aristocrats was coming to my castle to fuck my princess it would irk me.

But I think what it all comes down to is mental conditioning - you are hardened to it while I am not.

[Johnny Soporno]

Johnny, would it be fair to say that you are a swinger?

No, I don't consider myself a 'swinger' at all.

My experience with people who DO consider themselves as swingers has not been positive, overwhelmingly. The are usually members of established couples where the sexual-enthusiasm has died-out, so they permit one-another to have extra-marital encounters with others in the same dilemma.

I wouldn't stay in an internally-sexless relationship; at least, not as my Primary relationship, anyway.

I can´t say I am down for that kind of reality you live - at heart I am probably too insecure.

I hope you get past your insecurities, Couture, regardless of the lifestyle you choose to lead!

I have this unending desire to be the king of my own castle. If one of the local aristocrats was coming to my castle to fuck my princess it would irk me.

I can understand that - territorialism is pretty natural for our species... but so long as the visitors respect my 'eminent-domain', I don't mind if they bag a few does while on my land ;)


But I think what it all comes down to is mental conditioning - you are hardened to it while I am not.


Experience is the ONLY effective teacher, when it comes to this. First you would need to DECIDE that it made sense to you, and then you've need to experience the emotional-challenge of actually living through your girlfriends' sleeping with others, AND RETURNING TO YOU, APPRECIATIVELY, before it would all make sense on a primal, subconscious level.

Johnny Soporno
Lover of Women

[Couture]

Experience is the ONLY effective teacher, when it comes to this. First you would need to DECIDE that it made sense to you, and then you've need to experience the emotional-challenge of actually living through your girlfriends' sleeping with others, AND RETURNING TO YOU, APPRECIATIVELY, before it would all make sense on a primal, subconscious level.


I just had an epiphany from this Johnny. There´s a reason she is your primary - she comes back to you after this. If she didn´t, she wasn´t worth the time anyways.

Cheers!

[Johnny Soporno]

I just had an epiphany from this Johnny. There´s a reason she is your primary - she comes back to you after this. If she didn´t, she wasn´t worth the time anyways.

Bingo! "If you love something, set it free..."

I love to see the women I love happy - even if that happiness if augmented or supplied by other men than me, from time to time :)

Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy

[Poetry]

Bingo! "If you love something, set it free..."

I love to see the women I love happy - even if that happiness if augmented or supplied by other men than me, from time to time :)

Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy

That's where a lot of aPUA go wrong these days... It may just be the Poet in me (Hence the name) or the "selfless romantic," but I love women. Adore them, when it comes to beauty, I believe they are the pinnacle. Most "new" people to the community see the immediate benefit of more women, but pay no second thought to the morals/ethics/or ethos.

"Leave them better than you found them."

Words quoted for truth. Imagine if everyone were trying to help each other become the best person they can be, and enjoy what little time we have on this planet? Impossible? Maybe -- but that doesn't mean it should stop us from treating women the way they (most) deserve to be.

Women want sex as much as the men do, but unlike us, the confrontational alpha males, they would prefer things more subtle and drama free; hence, all of my, as well as many PUAs/VAs relationships, are no strings attached. If you want to leave, fine; but, I'll be sure the time spent will be the best it can be for the BOTH of us. If a woman isn't helping along the process to make things enjoyable and better than before, she can leave as quickly as she came.

As always Johnny, great post and ideology. Look forward to what you have in store for us next.

[milieu]

Very new here..still in sponge mode (and this seems like a fairly advanced topic) so I don't have much to contribute to the discussion [yet :)]. But I wanted to thank you for sharing. I found your post provocative and extremely interesting. I suspect that I can't really know whether this sort of lifestyle is for me until the first time I am on the receiving end, but it seems like an arrangement that is designed to truly benefit all parties involved, at least to me. Seeing the sense of it [intellectually] and actually living it are two different things, naturally.

But...it _does_ make a lot of sense. The level of comfort and acceptance that is both a requirement and a natural byproduct of this is really appealing.

Leave them better than you found them - ya know, I really hope that, on my deathbed, I can say "Yes, that's exactly what I did".

[Johnny Soporno]

Very new here..still in sponge mode (and this seems like a fairly advanced topic) so I don't have much to contribute to the discussion [yet :)]. But I wanted to thank you for sharing. I found your post provocative and extremely interesting. I suspect that I can't really know whether this sort of lifestyle is for me until the first time I am on the receiving end, but it seems like an arrangement that is designed to truly benefit all parties involved, at least to me. Seeing the sense of it [intellectually] and actually living it are two different things, naturally.

But...it _does_ make a lot of sense. The level of comfort and acceptance that is both a requirement and a natural byproduct of this is really appealing.


Thanks for that - I have been profoundly successful with this, and am one of the most consistently happy and well-attended people I've ever known as a result of it!


Leave them better than you found them - ya know, I really hope that, on my deathbed, I can say "Yes, that's exactly what I did".

If you work it out right, MANY OF THEM will actually be there, holding your hand and assuring you that you are loved. :)

Johnny Soporno
Lifestyle Guru

[LoveLeo]

Cool! Johnny Soporno - the best!