Coaching Program: Why you made a mistake by not signing up

[subzero]

I came so close to not signing up for this. I hope Discovery is not mad at me for saying this, but he didn't do the best job of explaining the benefits.

I am so glad I just said "fuck it, I am going to take a chance", because if I had not done it I would have made A HUGE MISTAKE

By day 3, and I already had gotten my moneys worth, from BOTH a pick up perspective, and even more importantly a life and relationships perspective.

This alone was a $10,000 class! This does not even take into effect the other 12 days of training I am going to get (gambits weekend, bootcamps, phone, etc.)

Here are the main points of what I have learned.....

Pick up skills - even though this is a coaching course, the pick up knowledge you will get is like getting a more advanced bootcamp
1) Learn how to identify and connect with your target based on personality. You will learn how to do this better than a psychologist, no joke! Remember Discovery does life/corporate coaching as well, he knows his stuff! *Do not underestimate how valuable it is to understand the type of person you are dealing with and how to best adapt your style to meet theirs and hence get the best result!
2) 4 nights of infield BUT we got 2 bonus nights as well (as a testament to no one watches the clock here, and the trainers gave it their all). This infield is geared towards learning how to coach, BUT you will do 30 sets during the 4 days so you will get some serious pick up practice!
3) This is way more than a coaching program, we learned skills to continue our own training way after Discovery is gone. We learned how to essentially microcalibrate ourselves to learn where we are consistently making mistakes.
4. Learned several KEY components that are not covered with any real depth in the bootcamp (roll offs, disinterest). Personally for me, learning how to properly roll off and communicate disinterest was of massive value.
5. Filmed ourselves so we could see first hand where we are weakest
6. Reviewed the M3 model indepth (via Lovedrop)
7. Learned fun gambits/routines
8. And way more, I will update this as I finally now have a chance to review my notes!
*In summary, even though this is a coaching coarse you got the value of an advanced boot camp

Bonus Pick up skills (not officially was not part of the curriculum but just to show you how Discovery gave this his all)
1) 30 minutes on AMOG techniques
2) Learned how to create a stack (for those of you who don't know how important that this is, I feel kind of sorry for you)

Coaching skills
1) The other aspect of why you should do this, and the main focus of this is that this is a business. You are essentially getting accredited to be a coach and represent the company
2) We learned how to microcalibrate ourselves and others
3) We learned why we are the way we are and what are natural weaknesses are, AND HOW TO SEE THEM IN OTHERS
4) How to connect with your clients in a way that will build genuine rapport by knowing how to quickly identify their personality type and their preferred style of communication

Other notable points
I was so overwhelmed with with all the info got i just wanted to sleep for a week. BUT Discovery actually forced us to do another 1.5 days of training. Do not kid yourself, the VA is training soldiers!

*For any of you thinking this should be free, you are thinking this because you do not understand what you are really getting. You need to compare apples with apples. It is one thing to be taken under someone's wing like a intern. If is another thing entirely to get a 4 day FORMAL 12 hour day curriculum that is more structured than any course I have ever taken in the corporate world!

*You are not guaranteed to be accredited, but I'm telling you with absolute conviction the knowledge you will get from a pick up perspective is worth way more than 10K!

[the modern]

So what % get accredited?

I came so close to not signing up for this. I hope Discovery is not mad at me for saying this, but he didn't do the best job of explaining the benefits.

I am so glad I just said "fuck it, I am going to take a chance", because if I had not done it I would have made A HUGE MISTAKE

By day 3, and I already had gotten my moneys worth, from BOTH a pick up perspective, and even more importantly a life and relationships perspective.

This alone was a $10,000 class! This does not even take into effect the other 12 days of training I am going to get (gambits weekend, bootcamps, phone, etc.)

Here are the main points of what I have learned.....

Pick up skills - even though this is a coaching course, the pick up knowledge you will get is like getting a more advanced bootcamp
1) Learn how to identify and connect with your target based on personality. You will learn how to do this better than a psychologist, no joke! Remember Discovery does life/corporate coaching as well, he knows his stuff! *Do not underestimate how valuable it is to understand the type of person you are dealing with and how to best adapt your style to meet theirs and hence get the best result!
2) 4 nights of infield BUT we got 2 bonus nights as well (as a testament to no one watches the clock here, and the trainers gave it their all). This infield is geared towards learning how to coach, BUT you will do 30 sets during the 4 days so you will get some serious pick up practice!
3) This is way more than a coaching program, we learned skills to continue our own training way after Discovery is gone. We learned how to essentially microcalibrate ourselves to learn where we are consistently making mistakes.
4. Learned several KEY components that are not covered with any real depth in the bootcamp (roll offs, disinterest). Personally for me, learning how to properly roll off and communicate disinterest was of massive value.
5. Filmed ourselves so we could see first hand where we are weakest
6. Reviewed the M3 model indepth (via Lovedrop)
7. Learned fun gambits/routines
8. And way more, I will update this as I finally now have a chance to review my notes!
*In summary, even though this is a coaching coarse you got the value of an advanced boot camp

Bonus Pick up skills (not officially was not part of the curriculum but just to show you how Discovery gave this his all)
1) 30 minutes on AMOG techniques
2) Learned how to create a stack (for those of you who don't know how important that this is, I feel kind of sorry for you)

Coaching skills
1) The other aspect of why you should do this, and the main focus of this is that this is a business. You are essentially getting accredited to be a coach and represent the company
2) We learned how to microcalibrate ourselves and others
3) We learned why we are the way we are and what are natural weaknesses are, AND HOW TO SEE THEM IN OTHERS
4) How to connect with your clients in a way that will build genuine rapport by knowing how to quickly identify their personality type and their preferred style of communication

Other notable points
I was so overwhelmed with with all the info got i just wanted to sleep for a week. BUT Discovery actually forced us to do another 1.5 days of training. Do not kid yourself, the VA is training soldiers!

*For any of you thinking this should be free, you are thinking this because you do not understand what you are really getting. You need to compare apples with apples. It is one thing to be taken under someone's wing like a intern. If is another thing entirely to get a 4 day FORMAL 12 hour day curriculum that is more structured than any course I have ever taken in the corporate world!

*You are not guaranteed to be accredited, but I'm telling you with absolute conviction the knowledge you will get from a pick up perspective is worth way more than 10K!

[AKHAN]

How does 360 coahing work?
you pay 10 k for 5 days training
and then you attend bootcamps and help student out only pay for flights and hotels not bootcamps, come to many bootcamps as you want for 6 months?

[subzero]

There is not a percentage accredited. It is all or nothing. I believe Discovery thinks that 70% will pass and even those whoe don't would have had a most amazing life changing and pickup skills accelerated learning experience. There is a very good reason why so few get good at this. BUT.....I was very lucky in another way. I have had the benefit of working with Top Cat and he is the best testiment to the fact that it is possible if you are TRULY dedicated. The guy is like a machine, he is doing what others fail to commit to....and he has only been doing this for a year.

****However, you are possibly missing the main point. Even if you didn't pass, this training is worth 20K plus. Review my bullet points. You get 16 days of serious training. You get the tools to become a legitimate PUA force! Look at the specifics of what you learn. I very clearly listed the content of what we learned. This is like attending a very advanced 6 month boot camp!

[subzero]

Q: How does 360 coahing work?

After paying the tuition you get 16 days of 'official' training.
But as I posted, these people are not clock watchers. Part one was supposed to be 4 days....however Discovery made us come in for an extra 1.5 days. I am exhausted and I still have 12 more days of training! If you want to know what the theme of the days is Discovery posted it, however if you want to know the real specifics of the skills I personally learned, review my post.....I am very clear with the topics that were discussed in depth during the first 4 day piece. If you want to learn those skills, you need to sign up. Otherwise feel free to flounder and be mediocre. :)

You pay for your own expenses, you must attend 2 bootcamps.

[AKHAN]

how much can all this cost?
10k for training
5k bootcamp?

[the modern]

Otherwise feel free to flounder and be mediocre. :)

1) that is a shit ton of training you are getting, even for the (relatively high) price tag.

2) I gotta say though, if you are going out 2 to 3 times per week on your own, you don't need this much training to get good. I'm curious subzero, if you don't mind my asking, where are your results at now, and where are you hoping to be at the end of this?

[subzero]

I believe the total current price is $11,900, but I believe the price is going up. We were the intro group.

[subzero]

Like I said, review the SPECIFIC key points we were trained on in ONLY 4 days. Dude you have absolutely no idea what kind of value you are getting. I have worked in corporate America for 10 years and I have never had a course that was this comprehensive and through. Plus I have taken a shared one on one training with Discovery (5K shared), I have taken the Bootcamp (3K), and Juggler's (2K), and this was unquestionably the best value.

Rather than listen to a bunch of people who tell you how overpriced things are, you should get the opinion of those who have actually experienced/ paid for other products and can intelligently discuss value. Let everyone else talk shit about high prices, talk to others who actually know what you get from first hand experience.

[subzero]

Reference: "I gotta say though, if you are going out 2 to 3 times per week on your own, you don't need this much training to get good. I'm curious subzero, if you don't mind my asking, where are your results at now, and where are you hoping to be at the end of this?"

A: No disrespect, but that is BS dude. You need to be honest with yourself!
Are you gaming 6s and 7s? Or are you gaming 9s and 10s? If you are gaming 6s and 7s with relatively decent success, you are actually wasting your time and making things harder for yourself! You might as well go say "hi, I am so and so....."

The M3 model is for gaming the hot as fuck model bitches. And you need a hella lot of training to do that. I have met a ton of people who have taken the course, and only 1 or 2 who actually can do this with 9s, 10s (recent students).

I really don't want to sound rude but your 'theory' on 3 days is enough is like a fairy tale unless you really are Neo from the Matrix. Again dude, be honest with yourself. Are you gaming 9s and 10s? If you are awesome, really! But if you are not, your 'theory' isn't worth alot. Again, no disrespect, I was just as guilty of this. But.....this is why I am doing something about it.

As far as myself, I am decent. I can definitely open, run gambits, close, DHV, close with 6s and 7s and a rare 8. But big fucking deal.

What do I want? I want choice, bottom line.

I don't necessarily want to fuck a zillion girls, but I want to know that when I see a girl I really want, a 8/9/10.....I have a pretty good shot to get it done! Plus in life, because of my interests in life coaching in general, I want to in general improve my skills and connecting.

Hope that helps. :)

[the modern]

First, a question, have you actually tried opening models with "hi i'm so and so?"

Second, you are definitely not being rude, I appreciate your bluntless, but ok, here's brutal honesty about my game. I can get 7s and 8s, the occasional 9, and i have been known to bang a 6 while drunk. I have been going out consistently at night 2-3 nights per week for the past year and a half, and did forget to mention I also do day game on other days. I figure with another 6 months to a year of solid practicing plus losing a bit of weight (not fat but i would definitely look better if I dropped these last 20 pounds) and I should be able to pull 9s and 10s at a decent rate.

I do think it's pretty disappointing that only 1 or 2 of a great many students that you saw are really getting the results they want. Does make me wonder if its the method working for those 1 or 2 or if those 2 just have something else figured out. Not that I know of any company doing better - in my experience most guys who take bootcamps don't get phenomenal results afterwards, even with some time practicing. I did know a guy who was absolutely terrible and got really good at some point after taking an RSD bootcamp. I think he even instructed for them for like a year as like a side gig, but quit when he met the girl who's his wife now.

[subzero]

Yes I have. And maybe 1/50 times I got a good response. But ask yourself are you doing this so you can be successful 1 out of 50 times, or are you looking for more consistency and control??????

Again, I don't know about you. If you are that one in 100,000 great...more power to you! Really, thats fantastic...I'm not gonna hate. BUUUUT for 99.9% of you people reading this.....you can either be honest with yourself or spend your life fooling yourself. I know what path I have chosen. :)

For example, I am going to tell you what happened today. I went and day gamed with Top Cat, who is bloody good! Also worth noting he has fully dedicated himself for a year. Anyways I saw a cute set of 7s, and said "hey go for that one." He turned to me and said "I only go for the 9s and 10s." I was like "OK." Then 10 mins later I saw another set of super cute girls that would make 90% of the people on this forum VERY happy. I again turned to Top Cat "how about them????" He looked at me with frustration and said "I don't think you understand what I am going for."

All of a sudden it really clicked. Rolling with these guys are like rolling as part of a military operation. The reason why so few people really excel is because almost no one really puts in the work that is necessary. Two nights ago I saw Top Cat deliver, he gamed a fucking 9.5 right in front of me, it was amazing!

If you saw these people in action you would have ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT.

I have seen Discovery and Topcat in action MANY MANY times. Those guys deliver.......CONSISTANTLY. Thats all the evidence I need. Also watching TopCats dedication (the guy games 6/7 days) you can see why he is succeeding. But I can also see that it is indeed possible for myself.

The End :)

[subzero]

Its not about where you are.....its the difference between where you are vs where you'd like to be.

A PU doesn't 'require' you to be structured. All that matters is that the crucial elements are there. This is partly why the coaching program was so awesome, it helps you understand your own personal learning style and what you need to do to make PU work for you. This program was not necessarily about structure, it was about focusing on where you are weakest and helping your students where they are weakest (as a coach).

Case in point, one of the other VA coaches joined us for these few days. I didn't know who Beckster was until the start of this, but this guy actually coached Style, and even Discovery uses some of Beckster's material. My point in mentioning this is not about how superior VA is since that is a matter of opinion of the user. Its that Beckster (if you ever saw him in action) is the most seemingly unstructured guy ever (at least to me)....but he delivers!!!!! So even though at first glance he is all over the place, EVERY element is there. He opens, challenges, rolls off, makes observation, DHVs....he just does it in his own fashion. To each his own right? Therefore regardless of your structure, this program hits all the crucial elements of the PU. Understand? Regardless of your style, structured, unstructured, this will help you take your PU to a whole other level.

Again its not about structure. Its about learning where you are weakest, and addressing that. For example you could start with qualifying or do it after 15 minutes....they both could very well work equally well. For me.....personally I do need structure, but thats my own personal learning style. Get it?????

[L.A. Tripp]

subzero, I applaud your effort at explaining things in this thread. However, I'm not sure modern does "get it". He's been told basically the same thing repeatedly in several different threads, yet he's still not seeing the big picture.

Beyond that, thanks for sharing your experiences. It's interesting to learn about others.

[Tonio]

I fkn hate you Subzero!!!!!! :p



That's awesome man....

I wanted to join the VA program but I guess next year.

Any updates? How's your game going?

[kaptenqk]

If I had 20k+ to throw away like that I'd have fun sarging instead. Not saying this wasn't a great experience.

But I guess you've got the money and want the knowledge so for you it's just a fair price.

[subzero]

I completed my first training in Feb, 9 months ago. And I completed the coach program 4 months ago.

I am easily 10 times better than I was before I joined. I did put in a lot of work. I am not concerned with perfection but rather appreciative of my own personal progress. I know what my 2010 year was like....and I know my 2011 was 10 times better in terms of women.

[subzero]

OK, this is a review of everything I have gotten in the last 7 months. In all fairness, you do have to take your own initiative to participate in things. But this is what I was able to get as part of the coaching program package.

- 4 day boot camp with infield
1 on 1 time with Discovery, Beckster, Topcat

- Additionally several full nights with Topcat beyond just the bootcamp time

- Five phone coach sessions to date that were 1 hour plus including Discovery and Matador

- Attended Gambits workshop and got to assist infield with Discovery. Additionally I could have attended Coaches Night which would have included infield.

Approximately 28 hours of infield with various coaches to date. During a normal boot camp you get about 8 hours. And I still have more opportunities coming up!

[Tonio]

I don't really post in the forum, but I read the posts and this guy is one of the few people in this forum that understands the importance of a Stack Routine. If you look for his posts he's consistent, improves over time, and offers nothing but value.

Subzero is someone who understands the elements that are needed to make your success repeatable. He was able to point out the key elements that were missing from my stack, explain the concepts, and showed me how to use them properly. Most importantly, I left our session with something real that I was able to incorporate into my stack. I have already seen a difference, and I feel a lot more confident going forward that I am applying MM concepts in the way that they were intended.

We specifically focused on my transitions and generating buying temperature quickly. He first went through my current stack and then broke down what was missing.
Specifically:
- sent me over 10 pages of information via email
- specified the only types of topics that should be introduced (relationships, body language, etc.)
- stressed that my material must be enjoyable for me and something I am congruent with
- directed me to sources that cut shortcut my learning curve
- and most importantly gave me SPECIFIC transitionary statements and gambits that I can use to bridge from my opener custom for me

If you are having problems applying MM concepts in a way that incorporates smooth transitioning and compelling content, Subzero can probably help you significantly!

And lastly to add, he was generous with his time and addressed my questions in a timely manner.

Thanks Subzero I really appreciate your help!!!

[subzero]

As far as I am concerned....today I have graduated from this program. Even though its not “official”. I got exactly what I wanted. I just spent 4 days 4 nights assisting Matador during a live training. So talking in terms of demonstrations that both Matador and the client can attest to....I completed at least 20 REAL demos LIVE. Everything from kiss closes, bounces, moves, isolates, ect. And I did these all COLD with NO social proof.

Lots of our reviews talk about the quality of the instruction, and thats great. But very few reflect after the fact about what the final results turned out to be. So that is the purpose of this review (as my other was about the quality of the instruction itself).

I am definitely not ‘natural’ at this stuff so I can full attest to what can reasonably be accomplished. I am by no means an mPUA, but I am now ‘reasonably proficient’ and most importantly consistent. Yes I do get blown out from time to time, but even in those cases I can handle myself with poise and grace. I am not special, anyone can do this. This article is about what you can reasonable expect with hard work.

Can I totally credit the coach program for this? Yes and no. Without the coach program I would not have accomplished this. But I needed way more than the tools provided by the coach program itself to accomplish this.

What made results possible...plain and simple was access to a body of knowledge. Might not sound worth 12K to you.....BUT IT ABSOLUTELY WAS. For example without that I would not have been able to just spend 4 days with Matador during a client training.

A lot of you might discredit what I say here in terms of “not being worth it”.....but you are wrong. Yes the training was first class.....but it was more conceptual than practical. I was never given a magical formula, only guides that I could experiment with. Ultimately I had to “figure things out.” The main benefit is that paying my fee allowed me to join the community which provided a huge support network, a network I could always come back to for guidance. Without joining this program, I would not have had access to these resources and I would not have succeeded.

From November to January I made some HUGE strides. I attribute that to 2 things. One my wing who also joined the program. He was the one who really hit home for me the shift in changing my behaviors to that of a leader, alpha as most of you like to refer to it. And then of course there was the recent 4 days with Matador. Everyone should work with this guy. He fully embodies what most of you all really need at the end of the day....a good kick in the ass, lol.

Also in November I did get to participate in the gambits workshop as a coach. I really appreciated Discovery giving me this opportunity.

But ULTIMATELY I had to use these inspirations to figure out things for myself. I had to figure out and experiment how I could take these peoples concepts and CREATE MY own way of doing it.

I learned along the way some truths about social dynamics.
There are no magical 3 words that are going to get things done.
Social proof is super huge and at the end of the day that trumps everything. That and logistics.
Even if you ‘mess up’, all she needs to see is you with a hotter girl and she will rethink her decision to blow you off, lol
Everyone gets blown out. You can’t get every girl. The best you can do is be prepared for how to handle it.

One of the other things I learned was everyone in life uses routines.
The client at one point said to me "I don't see you using any routines." I quickly corrected him. Everything I told him, was routines. All my stories, gambits, games, etc....all routines! I then showed him on my phone 300 pages of stuff I have collected and created in forming my own stack. The difference is I learned how to create my own everything! :)
For the rest of my life, I will be able to use and create stuff that is truly my own. No one can ever accuse me of gaming because all of my material is original (minus some soundbites of course).

Again the training (particularly Discovery’s coach bootcamp), the quality of instruction, and the passion was all first class, a little disorganized lol, but first class nevertheless. But I look at the main value as having access to resources as I tried to figure out things for myself, meaning taking the main concepts and integrate them as part of my own identity (which is what your stack is all about). This took time and frankly a lot of fucking patience, lol

So as a final message, alot of you out there might be thinking its not worth paying 12K to join a social circle of sorts. But again you would be dead wrong. I have met a lot of people in my life, but there is no one like these guys. It really has been a privilege to be around and learn from people like these. And I promise you with the utmost sincerity, no matter how much credit you want to give yourself, or your friend who you think is “so good with women”.....they would not hold a candle to someone like Matador. Matador is in the truest sense a charismatic individual who alone would be worth spending 20K for a weekend of learning. Not just PU but equally and perhaps even more so as a life coach.

So what now? I don't know how my 'coaching career' is going to go, or how much farther I will take my social skills. I care and I don't. Anything more at this point is a bonus as far as I am concerned, I got what I wanted. Dude, I even got a freaking hj on a plane ride on my flight to Vegas! And to me that is truly spectacular. Soooooo all I am concerned with right now is celebrating my accomplishment and relaxing. I am going to have an amazing steak tonight and do nothing but watch movies all day. :)

I wish you all the best with whatever it is you are looking to accomplish. Just don't waste any time looking for short cuts. If you want to accomplish anything in this life, Tony Robbins said it best. Find a model, someone who has accomplished what you would like to accomplish, and work with them. Pay whatever price you need to. What is a year of your life worth to you? If you are still looking for answers, why would you insist on shortcuts and waste any precious time?

Good luck!

[subzero]

Now in all fairness, you have to hustle a little bit to get these opportunities.....but I was REALLY ambitious! I got this all as part of my tuition!

1) 4 day boot camp with nightly infield
one on one time with Discovery, Beckster, Topcat, 3 of the world's best!
2 Additionally several full nights with Topcat beyond just the bootcamp time

2) Seven plus phone coach sessions to date that were 1 hour plus including Discovery and Matador. There are MANY I did not participate in! These were great opportunities to ask about any sticking points.....via phone...live.

3) Attended Gambits workshop and got to assist infield with Discovery.

4) Additionally I could have attended Coaches Night which would have included many hours of infield.

5) Spent a full week with Matador....7 full nights with the direct game master!

6) Could have participated in the Super Conference which of course would have allowed for even more 1 on 1 time with coaches

Waaaaaaay over 50 hours of infield with various coaches to date!

....and 10s of hours with coaches helping me personally with my game.

Plus I had MANY more opportunities that I chose to not participate in.

And.....my opportunities to continue to participate are endless at this point!

Final reasons why you missed out by not signing up.....
(some of you out there are more of a natural and will have an easier time with this, but regardless.....the only people I have seen who get at least proficient / consistent went the following route)

- spent lots of time with MANY TRAINERS. THis gives you the time to put all of the pieces together. More likely that not, one trainer alone is not going to have all the answers you need. It will take a while for this to click.

- The time you need to really let things sink in, reflect, and then come back to the pros for more clarity....this program is a FULL year.

- A support system you can ALWAYS come to as you reach new sticking points as you get better and better. Have this support system alone is a MASSSSSSIVE benefit. Because there is no guess work! There IS someone within the program that DOES have the answer you are looking for!

- And as a bonus of sorts.....not a guarantee though.....IF you prove yourself to be proficient/consistent at PU AND show yourself to be a good coach.....you will get to join a network where you can make back your investment VERY VERY quickly. You will have to demonstrate in front of two mPUAs.....this will not be easy......but it can be done!

Like I said before, if you are interested in becoming your best you.....you need to shift your current paradigm. This isn't just a course on just pick up.....its a way to become a more effective communicator......this will effect EVERY aspect of your life.....EVERY opportunity that comes you way.....your ability to convert will increase 10 fold!

Its not about becoming another Discovery or Matador or Mystery.....
its about become your best you!

Are you worth it?

For how long have you been trying to accomplish this?

How much more time are you willing to let go by?

Don't you deserve this opportunity?

Very few people will get good at this....

But the people who do will treat this like going to school....

They will understand what is at stake and just like anything in life worth obtaining.....

it will not come easy.....

enrolling is not a guarantee of anything more than ACCESS to the resources you NEED....

you will have to quite frankly put in a lot of fucking time and energy....

So how much do you REALLY want this??????

If you are looking for shortcuts this is NOT for you!

But for how many years have you been unsuccessful at 'putting it all together? 1 year? 2 years? 3 years? More?

I personally went 5 years before I was fed up. I had read/watched EVERYTHING and I just couldn't quite put it all together in a way where I was even a little consistent.....only glimmers of brilliance once in a while......but I was sick of having no control when the girls I really wanted would slip away for some 'unknown' reason.....

So are you ready to be honest with what it will take?

The truth is most of you out there really don't know how many 'moving parts' there are.....and you have a very little chance of putting it all together because you don't know what you don't know......

I even recently saw on LoveSystems "The odds are most of what you think you know is wrong." That is a VERY true statement!

however I do present to you a path where if you are willing to devote the resources.......

you can become your very best you!

[Instigator]

Hey Subzero

Just read through this and I agree with you 100%, I have not done the coaching program, I am VERY new at this, but I attended the Norway Seminar with Mystery and Discovery, it was with the In-field training. As I wrote in my review, of course I was worried about the price of infield, but having met those guys and done the in-field. Boy is it worth the money. Of course what I do with the tools now is up to, in addition I can already tell that there is a SHIT load of things that could never be covered in just a two day seminar as you mention the dept required to actually become a master is insane.

Just like a martial art, its constant training and improvement game, not something you read out of a book, do 3 nights a week and earn your black belt in.

[subzero]

yup, everyone in general thinks live training is a lot of money....

until they do it :)

people don't know what they don't know

the irony of it all is look how much money people spend on their education & careers?

why is success soooooooo important?

recognition from the opposite sex and choice is a huge reason, duh!

and now for some reason people shy away from this direct path cause it hurts their ego that they had to pay for guidance??????

instead they pick a path of frustration

they choose to waste years and years trying to 'figure it all out" rather than save themselves years of frustration....

....years that instead could be spent enjoying opportunities with way more women

....it shocks me that people would put such low value on such precious years while in their prime

it absolutely makes no sense whatsoever, lol

even worse they forget about the big picture

-yes i meet way more girls, but in some ways even more importantly my relationships with those are waaaaaaaay more fulfilling

- my business and work oriented conversations are way more effective and compelling

- in general ALL the relationships in my life are way more enjoyable

benefits waaaaaaaay beyond PU

[Instigator]

Career, education and health. I got into the fitness scene a few years back and trust me the coaches, protein powders and liquid chalk builds up to a pretty penny to.

"recognition from the opposite sex and choice is a huge reason, duh!" I agree, it is very much so, man recognition from the opposite sex makes a man feel like a man hehe.

We all need guidance, everyone had to start somewhere, even the naturals get better with guidance.

Exactly, it is what I am looking for, being a social a artist, not just a PUA.

You make some great points my man, if/when (call it what you want) I can get somewhat proficient in this I would love to do the coach program.

[Indiana]

I'm a believer.

Please, spend a night in-field with a master trainer: Discovery, Mystery, Matador, Lovedrop... and then decide.

Don't spend the rest of your life wondering "what if..."

[subzero]

You make some great points my man, if/when (call it what you want) I can get somewhat proficient in this I would love to do the coach program.
you take it to get to proficient!

all you need is a little bit of a foundation, even one live training is enough

I started it after my first 1 on 1 with Discovery, so I was in a very similar position

its not cheap though.....

but rather than pay for a ton of 1 on 1s or whatever, its an all inclusive deal what will give you access to the resources you need.....this program gives you a longer term opportunity to really internize.....access to work with master trainers, materials, and a HUGE support system

you take it IF you first want to get proficient, its not for after the fact

[Instigator]

but rather than pay for a ton of 1 on 1s or whatever, its an all inclusive deal what will give you access to the resources you need.....this program gives you a longer term opportunity to really internize.....access to work with master trainers, materials, and a HUGE support system

you take it IF you first want to get proficient, its not for after the fact

Hmmm interesting, So as far as you are concerned you could do the coach program whenever? The reason I ask is that some people are natural players on some level, then they do a bootcamp, get EVEN better and then take coaching, I am more like one of those guys who joined VH1 The Pick Up Artist level, like I went out on Friday (a week after the boot camp) and frooze up in-field. Would the coach program be a good idea at this point? or rather after I have at least some setes under my belt?

You are right though, its not cheap, BUT as long as there are ways to pay the price, and what you get is worth the money who cares ;)

[subzero]

you take it IF you first want to get proficient, its not for after the fact
Hmmm interesting, So as far as you are concerned you could do the coach program whenever? The reason I ask is that some people are natural players on some level, then they do a bootcamp, get EVEN better and then take coaching, I am more like one of those guys who joined VH1 The Pick Up Artist level, like I went out on Friday (a week after the boot camp) and frooze up in-field. Would the coach program be a good idea at this point? or rather after I have at least some setes under my belt?

You are right though, its not cheap, BUT as long as there are ways to pay the price, and what you get is worth the money who cares

Hey Instigator,
Besides coaching I do sales for this program. Just going to give you the facts.....then take your time and get back to me in a few weeks/months/whenever

notice these facts are NOT specific to VA, they are general based on what it will take to succeed regardless of who you train with

fact - you want to get good you will need a long term program, you have to immerse yourself in this.....no other way
fact - you don't have to have a ton of sets under your belt as long as you understand the model conceptually. If you have been to a bootcamp you should be fine. All of the students start off this way, I was no exception
fact - all longer term programs, WITH ANY REPUTABLE COMPANY are expensive, you can't avoid that either....regardless of which company you go with. For example, a one week Mehow residential is 6K i believe......thats just one week! disclaimer: granted, I bet the Mehow 1 weeker would be worth the money....no joke.

but .....I do believe though the coach program is the best bang for the dollar cause you will have access to resources for a FULL YEAR. I got a RIDICULOUS amount of time with mPUAs....RIDICULOUS amounts

to dos.....
*****I do sales, but many of the other companies have GREAT trainers.....do your research. what i listed above are general facts, NOT specific to VA. I know love systems and mehow have coach programs......figure out WHICH mPUAs youd like to train with. Challenge whoever, its your money. Just being honest, as the consumer you have options.

- most companies, such as us offer financing, so it can be made more managable

.......so $12,000 doesn't have to be quite as daunting of a figure, I know we are very flexible, still it is a significant commitment

- let this sink it, take a few weeks/months....whatever. But i wiil be honest, not too much advantage to waiting. Your real opportunity to grow is to work with others and to have a support network at your disposal......sooner you immerse yourself the quicker your results

ONE LAST FACT - a coach program does not guarantee results, it will give you the resources but you are going to have to REALLY WANT THIS....again its like going to school!

plan on at least 4 trips within the year for VA events....at least

plus you can hustle to get many more

plus most of the coaches are cool to work with you if you are willing to fly to them

personally I made 4 major trips to events and several minor ones including to work with other coaches......and I speak to various others in the program EVERY week......that GREATLY helps trouble shooting!

the resources really are endless!

have a think, get back to me sometime in the future

[Instigator]

Hey Subzero

To be honest, you dont need to sell to me, I WANT to do the coach program, well I want to be proficient in this. I like the VA approach not to mention that I think that Mystery, Discovery are great teachers. I also talked to Matador and he is amazing as well so I dont need to look into others. However there are just two "problems" to overcome, one of course being the money but one can work that out with payment plans and so on. The second and a bit more of a hurdle is the fact that I live in Norway, that is wee bit of an hindrance to get the most out of the program.

But boy I would love to do this "someday" and spread VA in Norway and Scandanavia as a coach

Thanks for a very detailed answer my man

[subzero]

I can set up you or ANYONE up for the Europe based coach program as well

remember the head of the program, Discovery, resides there so in some ways if you are on the other side of the Atlantic you are in a better position

first
- do you research, see what else is out there

second
- after you have researched and consider yourself an informed consumer to various packages that other companies offer....and you have decided to deal with the best trainers out there.....

- PM me directly and we can set up a skype call

regardless of where in the world you live.....I can get you/anyone set up and ensure you get the very best customer service

I might even throw in some free phone coaching....maybe :)

take your time though.....no rush....

this is a BIG commitment

make sure you are 100% committed financially / mentally / spirtually ......ect!

[Instigator]

Very cool, I didn't know that the coaching program was also done in Europe, I am guessing the UK. But yes you are right it should be done when I can commit to it, and to be honest I am fairly clear on my goals, I do need to figure out the best time to do this both money wise and because of my own business.

You are great salesman brother, and I will be getting back to you when I am ready ;)

[subzero]

well cool :)

well again take your time.....

but let it be known all VA sales people, lol if/when Instigator decides to join, he is my client, I will sign him up.....his customer service person is Subzero, lol :)

take your time though....research!

[Instigator]

Hehe I like this, you sweetening the pot ;) and yes I will get back to you when I am ready my friend.

[subzero]

this would be better marketed as a long term

"I AM FUCKING SERIOUS about getting 'good' at this program"

rather than a 'coach program' because those interested in long term program is who will most benefit!

I am hesitant to say 'mastery' because only a very select few will reach that.

But this is not about becoming a master.....its about becoming YOUR VERY BEST YOU.

That is all I personally gave a fuck about. :)

anyways...moving onward.....

As long as you have a 'basic' level of understanding (preferably 1 training prior).....that is all you need to enroll

you DO NOT have to be 'good'.....or even 'decent'

the program is what helps you to get good

all you need is a basic understanding of the model, and have opened and run sets before regardless of the outcome

I'd say if you have
1) - taken one LIVE training
2) - opened 100 sets post training

you are the PERFECT candidate for this

****reason not to wait too long after your first live trainining****
because a long term program like this will GREATLY reduce your learning curve because of your access to people who can help give you clarity when you reach new sticking points......and you will be reaching 'micro sticking points' weekly! I define micro sticking points as new variables added to the mix and there are HUNDREDS of these!

the program is best for people who realize what it will really take to get proficient / consistent....

if you read The Game......you realize those people were in it for the long haul....they didn't just take one course and call it a day

I personally did not think of this as a 'coach program', I thought of it as a 'long term improvement curriculum' of sorts with the 'possibility' of coaching others

BUT BY FAR MY NUMBER ONE GOAL WAS MY OWN SELF IMPROVEMENT.....thats all i cared about

and the coach program gives you all of these necessary components with a reasonable cost....

the following lists the necessary variables for significant improvement

1) it takes time to put the pieces together, time with coaches, then time to reflect.....this requires a long term program. This will be a year long project for most even with all of these resources. (for anyone without these resources, good luck in getting it done in 10 years,lol)
2) you need to work with several different coaches. you never would want to work with ONLY this coach or ONLY that coach.....everyone is going to have certain pieces that are going to resonate with you.
3) one of the BIGGEST benefits is you have access to an incredible support network and this might very well be the biggest deciding factor to how good you get. This 'network' who can greatly reduce your trouble shooting cycle time