"Now"

[-TruTh-]

The importance of this single entity is the very moment of which we live in, not the moment that past just now, nor is it the moment that shall come in a few.

Desires, fluttering into mind of a future that is never assured, loss this for it is center of losing the only moment that means. The past, are simply memories and layout plans for the present moment.

Great spaces of zero mind does it take to stay centered in this most precious of moments, the moment of this "Now".. of which we are all sharing and yet yield nothing but perceptions from the countless.

Never to seek, this the the fact, the only thing we must not lost the sight. The generational years that have come before have meaningfully cast a shade of shields surrounding what already lies dormant inside of each and every one.

The guy who towers, and that is built like a brick, is in fact no better, for he is just as equal. Stand aground as your minds lies become silenced with the ever gazing presence you create when you take charge to break the door.

Seek nothing, but rather look to the inner domains. This is the place of creation and building. See for yourself the very throne that lies empty in you, the presence that is lacking is none other then yourself, so take thy throne and sit with the grace of presence... and rule the mind as it has done to you with your own allowance.

Nothing, in this world can shake the person who rules his own domain, he is resolved and collected.

"Fear makes the wolf appear bigger then he really is.

The only madness I can possibly see right now is the fact of how many of us aren't living... but much rather existing.

Awaken, and you will find that things aren't the way you "Think" they are.

[BigJohnson]

Bravo Truth, bravo.

[-TruTh-]

Bravo Truth, bravo.

This was a moment where I just wrote what I was thinking. Besides the style format, its one of my better pieces.

Thanks for support, curious is there anything you would to hear my opinions on friend?

[bizzyb1]

My wish is to hit the level of presence you both appear to have. I have to ask you both, do you meditate currently or have you in the past?

[BigJohnson]

Thanks for support, curious is there anything you would to hear my opinions on friend?

Would you say that American culture is the "anti-now"? Would you imagine this being the root of depression and anxiety and all other forms of self loathing that are just so common in America? Do you believe that Western religion actually shoves people from peace and self empowerment by practicing worship for a "third party God"? Basically handing power to a source outside of them, opposed to realizing their own essence.

[BigJohnson]

My wish is to hit the level of presence you both appear to have. I have to ask you both, do you meditate currently or have you in the past?

Absolutely. You can also meditate while your walking around or running errands, to smaller degree.

[RAMM]

Yes, I do believe America has now reached the foremost peak in anti-nowness in human hystory.. and it's so addictive.. I go into presence for hours, days weeks, and then I'm draw back into this sick painfull "existing", and I'm not even American.

[-TruTh-]

Would you say that American culture is the "anti-now"? Would you imagine this being the root of depression and anxiety and all other forms of self loathing that are just so common in America? Do you believe that Western religion actually shoves people from peace and self empowerment by practicing worship for a "third party God"? Basically handing power to a source outside of them, opposed to realizing their own essence.

Sorry it took me so long to get back to this.

Its not just American culture, actually its not culture really at all.. its the people inside the culture who have formed this sense of self loathing that is destructive.

Americans, just are a lazy people.. that is a great flaw but there is beauty in Americans still.

Its society of the entire world.. its the person who convinces himself "NOT" to do what he wants. Its the people who create "Excuses NOT" to do what they want to do.

So many people "DO NOT DO" what they really wish they wanted that create this vapor of loathing.. its a voice screaming agony in thousands that creates the stigma of societies disapproval. And that is why those who make the choices to do what they really want, turn out to be strong and capable.

For the sake of staying out of the Fight Club, I believe that God shouldn't be external for people, hes internal.. hes inside us and that is why we feel him when we want to because hes already either the force that runs are bodies or a part of are soul.. or maybe hes a part of are bodies.

No one should ever sacrifice there own self happiness for something outside of them.

[azazels_wolf]

For the sake of staying out of the Fight Club, I believe that God shouldn't be external for people, hes internal.. hes inside us and that is why we feel him when we want to because hes already either the force that runs are bodies or a part of are soul.. or maybe hes a part of are bodies.

No one should ever sacrifice there own self happiness for something outside of them.

In my experience, all of these things. Tantric orgasm / kundalini ascension demonstrates this, very personally and unspeakably well.

[RAMM]

that's the problem, the danger of it is there is so much beauty in americans..

so much beauty in the pain, I am fundamentally loathsome..

[-TruTh-]

that's the problem, the danger of it is there is so much beauty in americans..

so much beauty in the pain, I am fundamentally loathsome..

"There is Sadness in Beauty"

A Japanese man said this.. and whoever fully understands it would know truth

[RAMM]

I'm not arguing with that.

In my experience there is beauty in sadness.. and desperation..depression..all that shit..

[-TruTh-]

[QUOTE=RAMM;148892]I'm not arguing with that.

In my experience there is beauty in sadness.. and desperation..depression..all that shit..[/QUOTE

I personally don't dwell on that stuff anymore.. it just became a huge bother.. so I threw it away.

[RAMM]

I guess I'm not yet ready.. I'll return to peace some day.. when this is all over..

[-TruTh-]

I guess I'm not yet ready.. I'll return to peace some day.. when this is all over..

The greatest testament and advice I can give you is simple, if you wish to be happy just do it.. you have that power.. you always have.

"Whatever challenges life loves to absolutely toss at us.. we must with fear and courage.. continue the path, we may get a few cuts and bruises.. but were still walking and smiling. :)

[dr_webber]

I believe that God shouldn't be external for people, hes internal.. hes inside us and that is why we feel him when we want to because hes already either the force that runs are bodies or a part of are soul.. or maybe hes a part of are bodies.


Zigmund Freud claims that god is internal for people, I wish I could remember what was exactly in the book I read about him.
he was a bit strange though, he claimed that boys are sexually attracted to their mothers and I read in the wikipedia that he had sexual feelings twards his mother as a kid.
his theories are mentioned in alot of books, The Subconcious is his theory and its mentioned in the secret.

okay Im changing the topic arent I

[BigJohnson]

Sorry it took me so long to get back to this.

Its not just American culture, actually its not culture really at all.. its the people inside the culture who have formed this sense of self loathing that is destructive.

Americans, just are a lazy people.. that is a great flaw but there is beauty in Americans still.

Its society of the entire world.. its the person who convinces himself "NOT" to do what he wants. Its the people who create "Excuses NOT" to do what they want to do.

So many people "DO NOT DO" what they really wish they wanted that create this vapor of loathing.. its a voice screaming agony in thousands that creates the stigma of societies disapproval. And that is why those who make the choices to do what they really want, turn out to be strong and capable.

For the sake of staying out of the Fight Club, I believe that God shouldn't be external for people, hes internal.. hes inside us and that is why we feel him when we want to because hes already either the force that runs are bodies or a part of are soul.. or maybe hes a part of are bodies.

No one should ever sacrifice there own self happiness for something outside of them.

So people of most civilizations are actively putting true consciousness in their back pocket, and replacing it with pursuits that death has the power to take away. Not even death, it's something an organization, or one person has the power to take away!

A world of people who find contentedness within would be of little use to someone who exploits peoples egotic search for identity through external gains. I think this is why cultures are seeing less and less true spiritual enlightenment. Instead, schools load children's heads with the past, to give them an egotic sense of "The power of the society, the power of the country." External identity from the get go.

I agree with you Truth in full. There is no external God. The only external presence that creates us IS the universe we inhabit its self. The hand of conscious intelligent design manifested in what we interpret as reality right this very second.

Anyone who is aware of geometry knows, if you take even a fraction of one whole, the fraction, though is small in size when compared to the whole, it still possesses every bit of makeup as the whole. Its is still one in the same.

EDIT - By "external" I reference the idea that God is a "He" or "In the form of humanity." God is no gender, has no facial features, no robes, no hair, none of it. Rather these ideas exist in the reality in which God is. The ability to make the traits with our own creativity is allowed by existence. Existence is allowed because time is, time is because matter is, matter is because light is, light is because dark is, dark is because darkness is nothing. It is the canvas before the elaborate painting.

[RAMM]

Freud and all the psychology that followed from his so called "discoveries" are a mass of BS if you ask me. The only psychology that has a scientific basis and has consistent results that one can test over and over again is NLP.

I do believe that the mother is viewed as a sex model and has great influence over our sexual taste as we grow up. In fact we do tend to look for similar characteristics in our mates as the ones our mothers have.

Anyway, back to god. I believe that saying God is inside me is quite a stretch.
The way I see it it's more like we are inside God. Our consciousness is like a subclass of God's consciousness.
It's like if God was an infinite geometric plane and we're a circle drawed on it. We are him but also limited. As we live(i believe in reincarnations, so as we live multiple lives) our consciousness is likely to expand more and more, though it's not totally authomatic. So we are more and mre like God, but never really God, he's infinite, and we develop in a finite trend.
That's how I see it anyway..
P.S. god is neither good nor evel, since such terms only make sense to human mind..

[bizzyb1]

I think this thread needs a clarification on the word God.
To some it sounds like it means an all powerfull being that lives externally.

To others it might mean an internal force that resides in us, which, once realized, has the tendency to make us stop looking on the outside for that evading reality, and find the truth in which all we ever need to be happy and fulfilled is our being. To these people god might be nothing more than a word.

[-TruTh-]

Here is my clarification on the way I view God, you won't ever see me put down anyone else for there beliefs but I can only share mine.

I can't describe God, I find it impossible to ever have the notion hes a big hairy guy floating in the sky, I just cannot see that happening. But there is one thing of which would make sense to a God, and that is life itself.. if that makes sense.

In each human there is a frequency of energy that is the exact same current as every other human. We all share this one trait no matter how different we are, I believe this energy to be life force itself.. and if it is the same in each person then perhaps that is God. So I believe that God is inside me and that is why I can sense a presence.

I guess the greatest words I can ever say is the fact that I don't really have any knowledge at all.

So back to my reasoning for the stigma of are people, when we were born we stood up.. because it was instinct to.

So basically the person who said the best way to learn is to unlearn and then learn the correct way.. is a genius. When we were kids.. we were fearless to chase girls... fearless to play.. we just did what we wanted. We need to retrain the mind to be that of a hybrid mind.. where the principles of being a child integrate into that of a Man. If we destroy the need for external approval then we have become free.

[azazels_wolf]

"As above, so below"

"God" is both immanent and transcendent. And that paradox is not irreconcilable.

[RAMM]

1. To some it sounds like it means an all powerfull being that lives externally.

2. To others it might mean an internal force that resides in us, which, once realized, has the tendency to make us stop looking on the outside for that evading reality, and find the truth in which all we ever need to be happy and fulfilled is our being. To these people god might be nothing more than a word.

and 3. We are part of him, not he part of us, makes more sense to me ^^

Just an opinion..

[BigJohnson]

We are a part of it.

"God" cannot be any specific gender. Different genders are apparent because you need a "positive" and a "negative" to make a spark.

Before male and female, matter was created from positive and negative. Men aren't positive or negative, and women aren't positive or negative, they are both either because it doesn't matter. The fact is their opposites.

"God" is the field of time and which these forces are allowed to exist. God didn't exist as a man in B.C. era robes floating through the universe BEFORE this era of man who WORE these clothes existed to imagine this God, in these clothes, and name him! Because we all know, this "God" existed before man, far before him. Why would he limit his wardrobe to his conceived era, years in the future? Did say, "You know, in a few trillion years, I'll make man, and in one era they will wear very nice clothes, I SHALL WEAR THOSE NOW, and forever! I shall speak this human language that I will give them the ability to learn, I shall think these human thoughts now! Yes, I will make these humans in a few trillion years!"

Its funny. The whole idea has clearly spawned from a mind.

"God" could be called many things. Strip your mind of everything society has taught you about "Godlike" entities and start from your own interpretation.

Let go, and recognize this force from ground zero. It is difficult to find a trace of gender.

In this light, there are the terms "God" and "Goddess." - Teaching you "God" means male, and "Goddess" means female. This is false, this is story time. Male and female, God and Goddess are merely ideas allowed to exist in time. Time is God, we are within it. All that happens within it is a product of it. Everything is a product of time.

God is god, there is one, and your sitting within it right now. The bible says "He is everywhere, he is eternal, he sees all." Of course, because it is everything. "He" is used as a metaphor to make it easier to understand. It allows your imagination, a primitive unreliable source of realization to draw this conclusion for you after the footsteps of many before you.

You must see scripture in its metaphorical sense, because that's what it all is, one huge metaphor. God created the universe, funny, so did time.

Imaginary conjurations of God will distance you from enlightenment. It is a constriction on your consciousness. Or a "limiting belief" as we call it. REALIZING God will give you your answer.

Realizing > Imagining.

[azazels_wolf]

BigJohnson:

Linear time is an illusion. Time in actuality is cyclical. On higher levels of existence, linear time does not exist as a reality. So how can time be "God", anymore so than anything else, rather than simply a functional part of the manifest universe? The very idea of the "Eternal" transcends time entirely.

Time doesn't create, it just allows for change to manifest and not be perceived to be happening all at once.
Consciousness creates. Love creates.

[RAMM]

We are a part of it.
"God" cannot be any specific gender. Different genders are apparent because you need a "positive" and a "negative" to make a spark.

Yes, I know. It's just my english that sucks sometimes.
See, in italian there would be no way of saying IT instead of HIM. That's why italian people are dumb, because of dunb language. German makes more phylosophycal sense, ever heard of that?

Anyway, as for:
God is god, there is one, and your sitting within it right now. The bible says "He is everywhere, he is eternal, he sees all." Of course, because it is everything. "He" is used as a metaphor to make it easier to understand. It allows your imagination, a primitive unreliable source of realization to draw this conclusion for you after the footsteps of many before you.
When talking about the one true god this is true.
But there are other entities one might call gods.
Especially in induist religion we have a lot of gods and goddesses. That is NOT a mistake. They really are "gods", they just aren't the one true god.
By gods in fact they mean energy entities or archetypes that have some influece over one's life. By believing any such entity exists, and by preying it you actually create it, your energy becomes a spiritual entity. So the so called "gods" are created by us humans and they feed on our spiritual energy, which they feed back to us in form of help.
And these "gods" are made of polarised energy, they have some human characteristics and they can be polarized as more male or more female.
But then we have the one true god that has been there forever and that has no human characteristics, and of which I know nothing. No one knows nothing. Even the christian god is not the one true god, he's more like the indian gods, an entity that gets large and powerful because of the energy one puts into believing him. Allah would be just the same. They all have slightly different energies because of different people believing them have different energies, but they share this nature.

P.S. anyone knows about teseracts? The thing's freaking me out.. it does explain things about the pinneal gland and how we can access information from the fourth dimension. I mean, we can't quite move into the fourth dimension with our physical bodies, but we do have a sense for it right?
I'm also starting to believe that the four-dimensionality of things is what creates gravity, and the reason gravity BENDS the space-time field.. which is freaky again.. but again this is only my personal theory, I've never heard anyone mentioning anything similar, or proof that it might be true, it just makes sense to me.

I do have a lot of "theories" of my own..:D I believe the big bang theory has a hole in it, that I fixed on my own.. but I'm not into the math of physics so I can't prove shit. I can tell you about it but I wouldn't wanna go off topic here..

[BigJohnson]

BigJohnson:

Linear time is an illusion. Time in actuality is cyclical. On higher levels of existence, linear time does not exist as a reality. So how can time be "God", anymore so than anything else, rather than simply a functional part of the manifest universe? The very idea of the "Eternal" transcends time entirely.


Ah hah I see what you are saying. Linear time its self is but a product of God force or God essence. If that's the case, time is god. Not more so that anything else, rather just as much, another extension of God's creation. Trees, plants, animals, humans, oceans, mountains, time, and space all being products of this force, living and interacting within this force, would make them a part of it's essence, one.

Time doesn't create, it just allows for change to manifest and not be perceived to be happening all at once.


Wow that's mind bending, and it makes sense.

Consciousness creates. Love creates.

I hear you.

[BigJohnson]

Yes, I know. It's just my english that sucks sometimes.
See, in italian there would be no way of saying IT instead of HIM. That's why italian people are dumb, because of dunb language. German makes more phylosophycal sense, ever heard of that?

Oh sorry Ramm I did not know. :eek:


When talking about the one true god this is true.
But there are other entities one might call gods.
Especially in induist religion we have a lot of gods and goddesses. That is NOT a mistake. They really are "gods", they just aren't the one true god.
By gods in fact they mean energy entities or archetypes that have some influece over one's life. By believing any such entity exists, and by preying it you actually create it, your energy becomes a spiritual entity. So the so called "gods" are created by us humans and they feed on our spiritual energy, which they feed back to us in form of help.
And these "gods" are made of polarised energy, they have some human characteristics and they can be polarized as more male or more female.
But then we have the one true god that has been there forever and that has no human characteristics, and of which I know nothing. No one knows nothing. Even the christian god is not the one true god, he's more like the indian gods, an entity that gets large and powerful because of the energy one puts into believing him. Allah would be just the same. They all have slightly different energies because of different people believing them have different energies, but they share this nature.

See they should not give people titles such as God and Goddess. It can be confusing as to what they actually have those titles for. Those who attained enlightenment over the course of recorded history were said to be "At one with God." Realizing their true self and their God essence. Which doesn't make them God, rather a part of God. I don't know whether these Gods or Godesses attained such states, or if they were just cool, or if they were good politicians or government officials. The term is thrown around too much to compliment traits that frankly aren't worthy.

P.S. anyone knows about teseracts? The thing's freaking me out.. it does explain things about the pinneal gland and how we can access information from the fourth dimension. I mean, we can't quite move into the fourth dimension with our physical bodies, but we do have a sense for it right?
I'm also starting to believe that the four-dimensionality of things is what creates gravity, and the reason gravity BENDS the space-time field.. which is freaky again.. but again this is only my personal theory, I've never heard anyone mentioning anything similar, or proof that it might be true, it just makes sense to me.

I do have a lot of "theories" of my own..:D I believe the big bang theory has a hole in it, that I fixed on my own.. but I'm not into the math of physics so I can't prove shit. I can tell you about it but I wouldn't wanna go off topic here..

Supposedly the Egyptians constructed their pyramids by reducing the gravitational pull around the blocks they were lifting. I don't know if this is fact.

The Egyptians hailed the pineal, and what it was capable of. It is an organ of sense, once it is stimulated your able to sense and experience things you assumed were never there.

[RAMM]

time is actually the fourth dimension. If we only had 3 dimensions, the whole universe would be just still, like a picture. But there are many still universes, and time links them one to the next one, in a string of "photograms" creating a moving universe, sort of like a movie.
Time is not the fourth dimension we were talking about earlyer though.. that would be more like a fifth dimension..

[azazels_wolf]

RAMM:


When talking about the one true god this is true.
But there are other entities one might call gods.
Especially in induist religion we have a lot of gods and goddesses. That is NOT a mistake. They really are "gods", they just aren't the one true god.


Also, another way to think of it is: if you consider the All, the ultimate reality or "True God" as a multi-faceted jewel.... each of the "gods" are like one facet, or a few facets, of the totality of that jewel.



Even the christian god is not the one true god, he's more like the indian gods, an entity that gets large and powerful because of the energy one puts into believing him.


Jesus in his original conception (and in the personal experience of him) is the Logos, the Word of God : the active creative principle the brings the world into manifestation through waves/vibration and divine intelligence. The Logos is the instrument of God, and an extension of God. The Christos is also pure Love which heals all.



P.S. anyone knows about teseracts? The thing's freaking me out.. it does explain things about the pinneal gland and how we can access information from the fourth dimension. I mean, we can't quite move into the fourth dimension with our physical bodies, but we do have a sense for it right?


Yes.... you know why divine figures like the Hindu gods are depicted with multiple arms or multiple heads? Because that's how 4th dimensional beings kind of appear in the 3rd dimension - they are in more than one place at one time, with a repeating pattern. Yes, our consciousness can access the 4th dimension - some astral projection experiences become like that as well.



I'm also starting to believe that the four-dimensionality of things is what creates gravity, and the reason gravity BENDS the space-time field.. which is freaky again.. but again this is only my personal theory, I've never heard anyone mentioning anything similar, or proof that it might be true, it just makes sense to me.


Yes, the existence of the fourth dimension creates gravity. But our current model of gravity is incomplete and does not explain everything that is observed - we're going to need a revised quantum gravity model. They're still working on that.

[azazels_wolf]

The Egyptians hailed the pineal, and what it was capable of. It is an organ of sense, once it is stimulated your able to sense and experience things you assumed were never there.

Yes - the Eye of Horus is actually a diagram of the structure created by the pineal gland and its surrounding glands when a cross-section of the brain is made.

[RAMM]

RAMM:
Also, another way to think of it is: if you consider the All, the ultimate reality or "True God" as a multi-faceted jewel.... each of the "gods" are like one facet, or a few facets, of the totality of that jewel.

Yeah, so that's the difference between the gods and the ultimate god, the number of dimentions they accesses.


Yes.... you know why divine figures like the Hindu gods are depicted with multiple arms or multiple heads? Because that's how 4th dimensional beings kind of appear in the 3rd dimension - they are in more than one place at one time, with a repeating pattern. Yes, our consciousness can access the 4th dimension - some astral projection experiences become like that as well.
Einstein and other scientists calculated the existance of 11 dimensions. I don't really know about that, we can hardly grasp the 4th dimention :D
But the thing I thought was "oh that's how god works!".
I'll explain, if you have 2 dimensions you got a static picture, but if you add time as a third dimension then you have a movie. In an infinite movie you can't predict/know everything there is, as you could do with a picture.
In 3D you would still have something static, unchangeable, unless you add time as a fourth dimension. That's what makes our world unpredictable. If we had 3 dimensions we could know everything about it, but time introduces unknown variables. Then They say that god know everything. Now that is freaky. How can he know everything(including future) in an unpredictable world? According to einstein the next dimension is a collection of parallel worlds, I mean all possible combinations. So next dimension is like all the possible worlds together. So If you had access to the next dimension, the one of the spirits and gods then you could see all of these possibilities at one time. That's how you know the future and other interesting stuff.
Again, if it's true that there ore 11 dimesions then the last one would have to necessarily be a static one, that doesn't changes because you would need one more dimesion to add change to it. Does it make sense?
If the ultimate god were the 11th dimesion then he would be static, and that's what they mean when they say he is eternal yet unchangeable.. he is always the exact same, he IS in a world without time and evolution.
I mean even if the dimensions were only 5 or 6, the last one would necessarily be an unchangeable one, a static reality. Even id they were 1 bilion, nothing would change... Makes sense?


Yes, the existence of the fourth dimension creates gravity. But our current model of gravity is incomplete and does not explain everything that is observed - we're going to need a revised quantum gravity model. They're still working on that.
I'm working on it :D
Maybe the part of matter that's in the fourth dimension and we cannot see is the one linked to other matter creating the attraction force in a way yet unknown..

[BigJohnson]

So sensing all this information in a microsecond, having the power of the universe's vastness present in you in sensation and extreme presence. - Inner game issues seem to fade into the background next to the awe and beauty of creation.

"Now" is the gateway to all of this. Feeling the love in your own being opens the door and radiates outward in a perfect fashion.

Interesting, there is also The Vatican City Courtyard Of The Pine cone Giant Sphere Sculpture Art.

The pine cone is a piece in honor of the pineal, depicted as a pine cone because of the pineal's shape, and function. Pine cones sprout outward, and is symbolize eternal life. This thing is huge.

[RAMM]

"Now" is the gateway to all of this. Feeling the love in your own being opens the door and radiates outward in a perfect fashion.


Maybe because the now is just a frame.. it's not confused, it's static and one can know theoreticly everything about it, with the right mindsed and awareness..
The deeper you go in the now the more it feels like time has stopped, at least in my limited experience.. is this consistent with yours?
I'm wasting so much time..

[azazels_wolf]

Yeah, so that's the difference between the gods and the ultimate god, the number of dimentions they accesses.


Yeah, and the resulting limitations and boundaries that they have.



Einstein and other scientists calculated the existance of 11 dimensions. I don't really know about that, we can hardly grasp the 4th dimention :D
But the thing I thought was "oh that's how god works!".
I'll explain, if you have 2 dimensions you got a static picture, but if you add time as a third dimension then you have a movie. In an infinite movie you can't predict/know everything there is, as you could do with a picture.
In 3D you would still have something static, unchangeable, unless you add time as a fourth dimension. That's what makes our world unpredictable. If we had 3 dimensions we could know everything about it, but time introduces unknown variables. Then They say that god know everything. Now that is freaky. How can he know everything(including future) in an unpredictable world? According to einstein the next dimension is a collection of parallel worlds, I mean all possible combinations. So next dimension is like all the possible worlds together. So If you had access to the next dimension, the one of the spirits and gods then you could see all of these possibilities at one time. That's how you know the future and other interesting stuff.


Have you heard of the idea of the "Akashic Records"? It is much like this...



Again, if it's true that there ore 11 dimesions then the last one would have to necessarily be a static one, that doesn't changes because you would need one more dimesion to add change to it. Does it make sense?
If the ultimate god were the 11th dimesion then he would be static, and that's what they mean when they say he is eternal yet unchangeable.. he is always the exact same, he IS in a world without time and evolution.
I mean even if the dimensions were only 5 or 6, the last one would necessarily be an unchangeable one, a static reality. Even id they were 1 bilion, nothing would change... Makes sense?


Yeah.
An interesting question would be though - if that dimension is static and unchangeable, how and why did it change in the first place in order to evolve/manifest into the lower dimensions which aren't static?
But - a timeless state would also mean that it never had a beginning.... :D No beginning, and no end...


Maybe because the now is just a frame.. it's not confused, it's static and one can know theoreticly everything about it, with the right mindsed and awareness..
The deeper you go in the now the more it feels like time has stopped, at least in my limited experience.. is this consistent with yours?
I'm wasting so much time..

The past, present, and future all exist in the Now. All that exists is in the Now. There cannot be anything outside of the Now. And yes, in the Now we have access to all the information contained in the collective consciousness / divine mind etc.



So sensing all this information in a microsecond, having the power of the universe's vastness present in you in sensation and extreme presence. - Inner game issues seem to fade into the background next to the awe and beauty of creation.


Yes... there are no "inner game issues" when you recognize that.



"Now" is the gateway to all of this. Feeling the love in your own being opens the door and radiates outward in a perfect fashion.

Interesting, there is also The Vatican City Courtyard Of The Pine cone Giant Sphere Sculpture Art.

The pine cone is a piece in honor of the pineal, depicted as a pine cone because of the pineal's shape, and function. Pine cones sprout outward, and is symbolize eternal life. This thing is huge.

Yeah, it's cool.
The peacocks symbolize the fire of the phoenix (kundalini risen into the head), as well as being associated with Melek Ta'us the Peacock Angel, otherwise known as Murugan / Kartikkeya / Skanda, son of Shiva. It all ties into kundalini, the Serpent Fire. :D

[RAMM]

Have you heard of the idea of the "Akashic Records"? It is much like this...
Yes I know about that.

Yeah.
An interesting question would be though - if that dimension is static and unchangeable, how and why did it change in the first place in order to evolve/manifest into the lower dimensions which aren't static?
But - a timeless state would also mean that it never had a beginning.... :D No beginning, and no end...
So if there's no begining and no end.. then the big bang/big crunch theories are wrong.. or they're just phenomena that hammen in the 3-4 dimensions, but does not involve the universe as a whole, meaning, we're all eternal. I used to think our "souls" were eternal meaning they were until the end of the universe.. but if there's no end of the universe then we really are for ever.. wicked :D

Do you think the universe started out with few dimensions and got more and more complex, or that it began with all dimensions already there or what? I ask because I can't understand the meaning of your first question..



The past, present, and future all exist in the Now. All that exists is in the Now. There cannot be anything outside of the Now. And yes, in the Now we have access to all the information contained in the collective consciousness / divine mind etc.
So the now and present are totally different... we should stop even calling it NOW. Presence is way better, and does not lead to this misunderstanding..

[BigJohnson]

Yeah, it's cool.
The peacocks symbolize the fire of the phoenix (kundalini risen into the head), as well as being associated with Melek Ta'us the Peacock Angel, otherwise known as Murugan / Kartikkeya / Skanda, son of Shiva. It all ties into kundalini, the Serpent Fire. :D

Its amazing how so many different religions hit the nail on the head. For instance, the Hindu's using the red dot on their for head to indicate the presence or awakening of the third eye.

The Egyptians literally had a snake depicted appearing from their for head. Indicating the rise of kundalini to its peak, as the energy passes through the third eye.

Even in modern medicine. The symbol used is two snakes (kundalini) intermingling up a gold rod (the backbone) to the very top which is constructed as "completion and radiance." The wings indicate freedom, and the feelings realized through presence, the ball is the pineal, the pinnacle. Which ultimately presents its self as a healing energy. Body, mind and spirit.

[BigJohnson]

Maybe because the now is just a frame.. it's not confused, it's static and one can know theoreticly everything about it, with the right mindsed and awareness..
The deeper you go in the now the more it feels like time has stopped, at least in my limited experience.. is this consistent with yours?
I'm wasting so much time..

You seem to in a way transcend time. While your present it seems your existence, and the fuel for your actions are no longer based on external persuasion. Such as, when your out meeting people, the external ideas which would typically hold someone back from having a carefree interaction are non existent while your present.

If your having a conversation with someone while your present, you will feel them, their words, and the emotion backing the words. This allows you to respond to them passionately and individually with no canned general responses. You can truly see the joy and innocence in everyone and you will go about bringing it out simply by being yourself, your true self.

Your able to know everything about presence because it is a void, a clear uninhibited stream of consciousness that is filled by each moment, and refreshed with each second that passes. It is intelligent because the behavior that is spawned from this void result from nothing learned, but learned for the first time in that moment. Each interaction feels like a whole new experience.

As you said in another post, being present while simply walking around surrounds you with something that feels new and fresh, vibrant and exhilarating. You may have seen it before, but it is ever changing, and you realize this through feeling.


So the now and present are totally different... we should stop even calling it NOW. Presence is way better, and does not lead to this misunderstanding..

The now and presence are the same ideal. To be present, is to be here now. To be here now is to be present.

[RAMM]

The now and presence are the same ideal. To be present, is to be here now. To be here now is to be present.

Yes I know NOW=PRESENCE. What I mean is NOW is not such a good word because it leads to some misunderstanding.. :)

[azazels_wolf]

Do you think the universe started out with few dimensions and got more and more complex, or that it began with all dimensions already there or what? I ask because I can't understand the meaning of your first question..


Probably the first, considering the current dimensional structure that gave rise to time probably didn't exist originally.... and matter was probably energy in an uncollapsed quantum state...


Its amazing how so many different religions hit the nail on the head. For instance, the Hindu's using the red dot on their for head to indicate the presence or awakening of the third eye.

The Egyptians literally had a snake depicted appearing from their for head. Indicating the rise of kundalini to its peak, as the energy passes through the third eye.


Yeah, the kundalini mysteries were at the inner core of all spiritual paths around the world. You'll see the remnants of it practically everywhere, especially in symbolic depictions.

Remember Buddha being sheltered by the 7-headed Naga king?
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_EcYLui_6qNs/SX-urkxwWxI/AAAAAAAAA1k/GyrkDcpeq08/s400/584px-Buddha_with_Naga_%28snake%29.jpg


Even in modern medicine. The symbol used is two snakes (kundalini) intermingling up a gold rod (the backbone) to the very top which is constructed as "completion and radiance." The wings indicate freedom, and the feelings realized through presence, the ball is the pineal, the pinnacle.


The wings also once again symbolize the ajna chakra (third eye), and characterize the snakes as alchemically "volatile" - meaning they are ascended, becoming dragons. The myths of dragons, as well as the Masters and other figures who are given the title of "Dragon" refer back to this force.



Which ultimately presents its self as a healing energy. Body, mind and spirit.

Yeah, it really is the ultimate healing energy. Kundalini was widely recognized as a healing agent on all levels of being, and could grant extremely long life spans. Hence, its recognition in the medical field.



If your having a conversation with someone while your present, you will feel them, their words, and the emotion backing the words. This allows you to respond to them passionately and individually with no canned general responses. You can truly see the joy and innocence in everyone and you will go about bringing it out simply by being yourself, your true self.


Nicely said. Presence truly does allow for a level of connection that most people are not aware of.

[RAMM]

Probably the first, considering the current dimensional structure that gave rise to time probably didn't exist originally.... and matter was probably energy in an uncollapsed quantum state...

I can't imagine it being so. The time cannot just begin. When does it begin? Let's say now time doesn't exist.. when will it exist? In a milion years? Makes no friggin sense.

Again, if the universe is eternal and totally determined on the higher dimension, this cannot be born out of the lower dimensions. Can the timeles be born out of time? Can infinite be born out of the finite?

Einstein was right afterall, God don't play dice. Quantum mechanics only seem casual in the 3D+time.

Again, the uncollapsed quantum state before the time was created is part of phenomenological world, that is the 3D+t. If the entire universe were non existent in all of it's dimensions.. if nothing is, neither space nor time, then there is no way there will ever be.Things don't come out of the blue. If instead the universe, at least on a higher plane is eternal it must have been here forever. No beginning.

This makes more sense to my mind right now, though I can make other hypothesis..
If the intelligence(or God) that creates the world manifests itself in the higher dimension while ruling over the lower ones, could this intelligence come from the lower dimesions? Even with evolution one couldn't CREATE the upper dimensions out of nowhere. Feels like lifting yourself by your own bootstraps to me.

[BigJohnson]

"Let there be light."

Perhaps the with the birth of light, also came time.

[azazels_wolf]

RAMM:

You hit upon the paradox inherent within all creation stories: How did something come from nothing? If the universe began as pure potential, with no differentiation in any part, what caused something to differentiate - what caused the Nothing/Everything to become Something? Unless the Something has always existed....


In dimensions that transcend time, all things are happening at once. Time would have existed once what we know as "change" actually occurred. In order for change or movement to take place, time would have had to come into being. So the emergence of ANY particles/waves would have necessitated the emergence of time concurrently. But that also means that, on some level, infinity is Now... so if all things are actually happening at once into infinity, then why couldn't the intelligence of the lower dimensions give creative feedback into the higher dimensions, in an infinite loop? There would be no limits... past and future would all be One... intelligence would all be part of one total consciousness that permeates everything at all times, in endless quantum entanglement.

[RAMM]

"Let there be light."

Perhaps the with the birth of light, also came time.

yeah, I guess out came God and he turned on the light switchhttp://www.daviddarling.info/images/light_switch.jpg and he had sexy hands :D

[RAMM]

RAMM:
You hit upon the paradox inherent within all creation stories: How did something come from nothing? If the universe began as pure potential, with no differentiation in any part, what caused something to differentiate - what caused the Nothing/Everything to become Something? Unless the Something has always existed....

The way I see it would have to be an even greater paradox.. see, "pure potential universe" even if il talks matter it still needs the presence of spacial dimension and time, otherwise the potential is ZERO. Potential=power to, or possibility. There no possibility anything ever happened out of time and space.The point is, admitting the universe was born at some point, before that, there would have to be nothing, including no potential whatsoever. Out of no potential there can't come out anything, let alone a whole universe.
That's why the universe in some form must have always been there, maybe timeless but still with some type of dimensions or something.


The alternative would be a big bang like theory where the big bang creates two timelines, one that goes to the future and one that goes to the past. Time created in both directions at the same time. Then matter would go all into the future(what we perceive as future) and anti-matter would go to the past, in a universe that mirrors our own very likely. This might seem a bit too science-fictious but, it makes a lot of sense:
if only matter existed, then the universe would be out of balance, where did all the matter come from? You can't create matter out of nothing. They have theorised the existence of a quantity of antimatter equal to that of matter, but how come no one's ever found more than a single subatomic particle of it??
If matter and antimatter are balanced, then they CAN come out of nowhere!
It's like.. you can't make a 10 out of a zero, but you can make a 10 and a -10 out of a zero. Same thing goes with time. If we only had it going one way, then time should have started out of nowhere. But if it goes in both directions then the total sum is zero, like in the absence of the universe.
This whole thing is my own theory(wrote it down when I was like 18).


But that also means that, on some level, infinity is Now... so if all things are actually happening at once into infinity, then why couldn't the intelligence of the lower dimensions give creative feedback into the higher dimensions, in an infinite loop? There would be no limits... past and future would all be One... intelligence would all be part of one total consciousness that permeates everything at all times, in endless quantum entanglement.
That's one of my other theories also :D(probably others have said it, but I ain't read it anywhere yet).
I believe we create our past in many ways. The past doesn't seem any more DETERMINED than the future the way I see it. Ever noticed how we can chance the meaning of an experience a thousand times and it's still "true" everytime? We can change our pasts in our minds, and it becomes true.
Now, talking about evolution, they always say it took life too little time to born/evolve. They say it should have taken bilions more years for life to start on earth, even considering that life complex molecules might have come from somewhere else, it would still be quite fast.

The way I see it might explain why it DID happen.
Parallel universes: here we have the begining of the universe, pure potential right? That pure potential starts evolving but does it do it totally by chance? It's quantum mechanics so it is influenced by consciousness. But we're at the beginning of the universe, with no life forms and no consciousness. But we know from quantum mechanics that if consciousness does not collapse infinite potentia into matter, then we have no matter, no objects, no nothing. How could then the universe evolve up to the point where the first living being/consciousness was born? Soem will say "but there was god's consciousness, duh?!". I don't think that's what made it all start.
What I believe that POTENTIAL CONSCIOUSNESS is just the same as consciousness. So we have infinite universes(the spectrum of potential) and out ofthose infinite universes, there is one where life will start in a shorter time then will happen in the others, then also this life in potential has consciousness, that determines the universe itself, back into the past up to when itall started. So the first conscious being CREATED the past and it's own whole history. That's why I say we created the universe. That's also why I say, god is our consciousness evolved from the future. Immagine an infinite time from now, where our consciousness is all encompassing and one with the universe, we are god. And from that moment, we also affect the whole past. So actually god is us in potential. And we're the ones who created the universe. Makes sense?

[BigJohnson]

yeah, I guess out came God and he turned on the light switchhttp://www.daviddarling.info/images/light_switch.jpg and he had sexy hands :D

Haha.. I mean, from the moment started creating distance and speed. As it were, traveling outward in all directions from one point.

[RAMM]

Haha.. I mean, from the moment started creating distance and speed. As it were, traveling outward in all directions from one point.

Yeah bro, I know.. but I just couldn't resist :D

Wouldn't eveyone worship such a God though? I think the old jew god only had marketing problems, that's why it don't sell much nowadays :D

[BigJohnson]

Yeah bro, I know.. but I just couldn't resist :D

Wouldn't eveyone worship such a God though? I think the old jew god only had marketing problems, that's why it don't sell much nowadays :D

Sure, technically a lot of people do.

A long time ago, the sun was considered God. "The bringer of light" or "The one who wards off darkness." In a time where the sun is nothing but a warm bright ball in the sky, your pretty open to assumption. Given the power the sun has, people considered it rather godly. This may be where the idea of a God of form sprang about.

[azazels_wolf]

The way I see it would have to be an even greater paradox.. see, "pure potential universe" even if il talks matter it still needs the presence of spacial dimension and time, otherwise the potential is ZERO. Potential=power to, or possibility. There no possibility anything ever happened out of time and space.The point is, admitting the universe was born at some point, before that, there would have to be nothing, including no potential whatsoever. Out of no potential there can't come out anything, let alone a whole universe.
That's why the universe in some form must have always been there, maybe timeless but still with some type of dimensions or something.


It's a very good point. The very instant any type of manifestation occurred, the instant a "Big Bang" began, would have necessitated the existence of time and spatial dimension. So there must have been something there for this potential to have been there...

The theory of the Big Bang itself actually does not tell us about the initial condition of the universe... it postulates a primordial state of the universe that was extremely dense and hot, from which it expanded, but even the Big Bang theory has no explanation for the state of the universe before that point.



The alternative would be a big bang like theory where the big bang creates two timelines, one that goes to the future and one that goes to the past. Time created in both directions at the same time. Then matter would go all into the future(what we perceive as future) and anti-matter would go to the past, in a universe that mirrors our own very likely. This might seem a bit too science-fictious but, it makes a lot of sense:
if only matter existed, then the universe would be out of balance, where did all the matter come from? You can't create matter out of nothing. They have theorised the existence of a quantity of antimatter equal to that of matter, but how come no one's ever found more than a single subatomic particle of it??


They have found more antimatter than that:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimatter

They theorize that there would had to have been matter and antimatter in equal amounts at the "beginning" - however, somehow, there was slightly more matter than antimatter, resulting in the annihilation of most of it, with the leftover matter being the excess that remains....
And so that is another unsolved mystery - how/why did more matter than antimatter arise at the beginning?

Unless they never annihilated each other and as you say the majority of antimatter is somewhere else, unobserved... but that would require another reworking of the Big Bang theory, and I'm not sure what evidence there is to support it. Interesting thought though!



If matter and antimatter are balanced, then they CAN come out of nowhere!
It's like.. you can't make a 10 out of a zero, but you can make a 10 and a -10 out of a zero. Same thing goes with time. If we only had it going one way, then time should have started out of nowhere. But if it goes in both directions then the total sum is zero, like in the absence of the universe.
This whole thing is my own theory(wrote it down when I was like 18).


That works on a basic level, though on a universal level I'm not sure that would explain what gave the original Nothing/Everything an impetus to turn into Something. For what reason would it have changed from its original state at all?? Why would Nothing become Something?



That's one of my other theories also :D(probably others have said it, but I ain't read it anywhere yet).
I believe we create our past in many ways. The past doesn't seem any more DETERMINED than the future the way I see it. Ever noticed how we can chance the meaning of an experience a thousand times and it's still "true" everytime? We can change our pasts in our minds, and it becomes true.
Now, talking about evolution, they always say it took life too little time to born/evolve. They say it should have taken bilions more years for life to start on earth, even considering that life complex molecules might have come from somewhere else, it would still be quite fast.

The way I see it might explain why it DID happen.
Parallel universes: here we have the begining of the universe, pure potential right? That pure potential starts evolving but does it do it totally by chance? It's quantum mechanics so it is influenced by consciousness. But we're at the beginning of the universe, with no life forms and no consciousness.


But you're assuming there was no consciousness in the beginning. Why? We already know that consciousness on a quantum level does not have to originate in "life forms" as we know them.


But we know from quantum mechanics that if consciousness does not collapse infinite potentia into matter, then we have no matter, no objects, no nothing. How could then the universe evolve up to the point where the first living being/consciousness was born? Soem will say "but there was god's consciousness, duh?!". I don't think that's what made it all start.
What I believe that POTENTIAL CONSCIOUSNESS is just the same as consciousness.


But that would also mean that "in the beginning" there was consciousness too, since it was potential consciousness.


So we have infinite universes(the spectrum of potential) and out ofthose infinite universes, there is one where life will start in a shorter time then will happen in the others, then also this life in potential has consciousness, that determines the universe itself, back into the past up to when itall started. So the first conscious being CREATED the past and it's own whole history. That's why I say we created the universe. That's also why I say, god is our consciousness evolved from the future. Immagine an infinite time from now, where our consciousness is all encompassing and one with the universe, we are god. And from that moment, we also affect the whole past. So actually god is us in potential. And we're the ones who created the universe. Makes sense?

Yeah, and that's fairly consistent with the existent esoteric theories.
There's also the theory that we (our higher selves, part of the all-knowing god that you refer to) create (on a smaller scale) our own lives, and life events, before we even are born. That this higher self determines what we will experience so that we can learn specific lessons, and then we actually go in and experience it according to plan. Which would mean that some future consciousness, or consciousness completely outside of time, already determined what will happen by its own awareness observing it. Hence, past, present, and future all occurring at once.

[RAMM]

They theorize that there would had to have been matter and antimatter in equal amounts at the "beginning" - however, somehow, there was slightly more matter than antimatter, resulting in the annihilation of most of it, with the leftover matter being the excess that remains....
And so that is another unsolved mystery - how/why did more matter than antimatter arise at the beginning?
I don't even need to tell you that makes no sense.

Unless they never annihilated each other and as you say the majority of antimatter is somewhere else, unobserved... but that would require another reworking of the Big Bang theory, and I'm not sure what evidence there is to support it. Interesting thought though!
Somewhere else, or some other time.. that's why we don't meet it.

That works on a basic level, though on a universal level I'm not sure that would explain what gave the original Nothing/Everything an impetus to turn into Something. For what reason would it have changed from its original state at all?? Why would Nothing become Something?
The only explenation I was able to find was future potential consciousness, otherwise known as "us" :) And it only maes sense if that something(namely matter) would be counterbalanced by antimatter. That article you gave me said that all the antimatter ever produced at the CERN is barely enough to light a single light bulb for a few minutes. But in order to produce all ofthat antimatter they used an enormous quantity of energy, haven't they?
It takes energy to produce antimatter but does it take energy create both matter and antimatter in equal quantities at the same time if you have the right producion technique? Maybe not, maybe we only need consciousness to do that.

But you're assuming there was no consciousness in the beginning. Why? We already know that consciousness on a quantum level does not have to originate in "life forms" as we know them.
Tell me more about that please..


But that would also mean that "in the beginning" there was consciousness too, since it was potential consciousness.
Yes that is exactly my point. even if consciousness is born in the future, it exists all along the timeline, since time is only an illusion,and consciousness can bias that and be free of time. Is there any other god other than out own future potential? I mean both human and alien assuming aliens exist.


Yeah, and that's fairly consistent with the existent esoteric theories.
There's also the theory that we (our higher selves, part of the all-knowing god that you refer to) create (on a smaller scale) our own lives, and life events, before we even are born. That this higher self determines what we will experience so that we can learn specific lessons, and then we actually go in and experience it according to plan. Which would mean that some future consciousness, or consciousness completely outside of time, already determined what will happen by its own awareness observing it. Hence, past, present, and future all occurring at once.
Yeah I guess I should read more and stop reinventing the wheel.

I heard from some physicist, maybe in What the Bleep do we know, I vcan't recall... that "quantum mechanics has not yet managed to take God out of the equation".
They just need to explain what god is cuz the way I see it, quantum mechanics is the study of everything god/consciousness created, as at the same time god is putting his hands in the cake and transforming it.
That's why it's so hard to understand. It's like watching a football match with invisible players and try to figure out the formulas for the patterns the ball is moving in.
It would be so much easier to do if one was taking into account the players themselves. That means, it would be so much easyer to study quantum mechanics if one was taking into account consciousness and god.

[BigJohnson]

It's like watching a football match with invisible players and try to figure out the formulas for the patterns the ball is moving in.
It would be so much easier to do if one was taking into account the players themselves. That means, it would be so much easyer to study quantum mechanics if one was taking into account consciousness and god.

Good way to put it. Consciousness is something that requires much consideration when trying to uncover the origins of the universe. If it existed before time, its possible that time is a product of consciousness directly.

Before human consciousness, matter was the only thing with a receptive quality. Anti matter, the medium. Radio waves and sound waves, if not meant to contribute to energy and matter, are meant to be perceived by and influence consciousness. Matter to anti matter to matter.

The sun, to run rays, to heat and light on a distant planet. Perceived and influenced by the life it sustains.

[RAMM]

uhmmm I'm not sure that would be considered consciousness.. I was curious to see if Azazel meant the same thing..

[BigJohnson]

No that its self isn't yer right, but the force that created this relationship is. I mean its a pretty amazing series of events that occurs to make shit happen but they are pretty simple concepts at the same time.

I have a huge hunch that time began with light.. think about it. Intelligent design could have created all sorts of matter and anti matter. Although, could you see plants, growing, and bacteria that feeding off those plants and what they produce without light? Water would be useless in sustaining life without light. Once there is a light source, a "sun," it creates movement. Planets orbit around the light source, as the light source casts linear time on each planet. If Earth were sitting somewhere else, with less light, say where Pluto is, I wouldn't be here in this time line typing this about time, ya know? Evolution would have never happened, no plants, no oxygen, no ozone, water, yes, plenty of it, but the planet would sit still in a sense of life.

First comes light, then the building blocks of evolution.

But even deeper than that. "Non-life time" is like a light wave. The fact that the universe is uncaged means the wave can radiate forever constantly. Its the result of the universe being split through at some point. A massive black whole, maybe, or a force that is able to interact with the dimension of time physically, take one spot in time, and drag it forward carrying us along for the ride. Perhaps a black whole that is moving in a certain direction. The weird things is if this is true, then there are two divided symmetrical parts. One on each side of this force. Which means there could be an exact replica of all that is, somewhere else being dragged along with it on the other side. Its like taking a piece of paper and tearing it down the middle, the point of the tear being this force, the two sides being time being dragged with it in the direction of the tear, forever.

[RAMM]

the whole light concept is poetry, not science. I have a harder time keeping track of your brainstorming stream of consciousness than usual.. no offense man..

[L.A. Tripp]

Doesn't light just illuminate what is already happening? Instead of creating what's happening?

[RAMM]

well, light does have some interesting and unexpected features but i don't think it's the alpha&omega of the universe. That sounds more like american indian philosophy

[BigJohnson]

Doesn't light just illuminate what is already happening? Instead of creating what's happening?

It does illuminate things that are already there, yes. Although what is happening is also the result of light, in one way or another.

[L.A. Tripp]

It does illuminate things that are already there, yes. Although what is happening is also the result of light, in one way or another.

How do you figure?

[BigJohnson]

the whole light concept is poetry, not science. I have a harder time keeping track of your brainstorming stream of consciousness than usual.. no offense man..

None taken.
Light has far more than visual qualities. On a long enough time line, the physical effects of light are able to create a seemingly multidimensional effect. In fact, if you were to travel at the speed of light, technically, time would stop.

Time = Mass moving past Light. The Earth orbiting the sun, mass expansion is mass moving past light. Gravity is mass expansion. Therefore gravity is = to time.

Einstein was infatuated by light. He was responsible for discovering that light bends. Which raised questions about time travel. The idea was to fold the middle to shorten the length between a certain span of time in space. - A possibility? I'm not in a place to say, since there is no known domestic way to bend light, or, find a specific "middle."

The strength of gravity is inversely proportional to the speed of light. I.E. Black wholes may be the only force able to slow light, or linear time in a physical sense.

Which means -

If the speed of light Increases, gravity decreases.
If the speed of light Decreases, gravity increases.

But none of this happens without light. Light is inversely proportional to time.

[BigJohnson]

How do you figure?

The fact that we are on Earth, moving at the speed we are moving, and perceiving time how we experience it, creates a sort of narrow idea of what it is, and the factors necessary to create linear time, and make it "go," always.

Try and view light as the LEAST dense form of matter, ever. Try to imagine how it could contribute to very dense matter. Also, take in consideration that every possible color is the result of one color, light.

[RAMM]

Ok this does make sense. But I feel like the speed of light has more to do with some space and time constant that's inherent to the structure of the universe that has an impact on everything there is, particularly light. What I mean is the speed of light is consequence of some other thing, the cause is not the light itself. Things can move no faster than the speed of light that is true. But that does not mean the light has anything to do with this. It's more likely that the maximum speed of light is set by the universe space allowing things to move in it up to that speed and no higher than that.

But what you say is a theory and makes sense.. I couldn't tell which one is the truth.

[BigJohnson]

If time were to stop, light would stop casting outward, meaning we would not be able to see the starts trillions and trillions of miles away. We would not even be able to see the sun even though its so close. What would the sun look like if we couldn't see its light? We can never know because the sun was here before earth. Light is a constant as long its source exists. Its source will always burn out or die. Which indicates light is physical matter being exerted outward in the for of energy. The fact that is lacks density is what makes it constant, and able to sustain its self for so long. If light were shining over a black whole, you'd see the beams suddenly turn into the whole, and swirl into it at very slow speeds.

Once light begins to travel at what is the quickest known speed in existence, the bar is set for time. Anything moving slower than light is captured within it in the form of time. Anything moving faster than light is not within this dimension. Its invisible. And its less dense than light.

Imagine moving at 99.9% of the speed light then trying to shine a flashlight in front of you. Time would literally almost be standing still. Its would be in ridiculous real time slow motion just before halting.

A bit off topic but have you heard of that black whole machine they made in Switzerland?

[L.A. Tripp]

Anything moving faster than light is invisible. Yeah, that makes sense. Because the light is no longer shining on it. However, that doesn't mean it's not there. You just don't see it.

Now, you're saying light and time are the same thing, but if an object is moving faster than light, then it's moving at a faster rate of time, so wouldn't that mean light and time aren't the same, since something else is moving faster than time?

[RAMM]

Anything moving faster than light is invisible. Yeah, that makes sense. Because the light is no longer shining on it. However, that doesn't mean it's not there. You just don't see it.
No, it has been theoreticly shown that nothing can move faser than the speed of light. But it has nothing to do with weather you see it or not. Things just can't move any faster because the universe won't allow it.
I have heard they did found something that moves faster than the light but I dunno about that, if anyone heard that please share.
The only thing muving faster than light tha I know is quantum entanglement, but it has no speed actually, it's insantaneous over any distance, but it does not mve actually, so it's different.

If time were to stop, light would stop casting outward, meaning we would not be able to see the starts trillions and trillions of miles away. We would not even be able to see the sun even though its so close. What would the sun look like if we couldn't see its light? We can never know because the sun was here before earth.

If I were to take my eyes out I still wouldn't be able to see the stars yet that doesn't mean things aren't still there.

But there is a point in all this, we as observers determine what the reality is and most of the time we use light to determine what that reality is. Thigs an observer cannot see never become real, they're only potential. But I think that we are in touch with far things because of quantistic entanglement with all the matter in the universe, and we don't need light lo know things are out there actually.


A bit off topic but have you heard of that black whole machine they made in Switzerland?

I knew they had one of the biggest particle accelerator down there at the CERN, is that what you mean?

[BigJohnson]

Anything moving faster than light is invisible. Yeah, that makes sense. Because the light is no longer shining on it. However, that doesn't mean it's not there. You just don't see it.

Now, you're saying light and time are the same thing, but if an object is moving faster than light, then it's moving at a faster rate of time, so wouldn't that mean light and time aren't the same, since something else is moving faster than time?

lol I'm speaking of light's relationship to time. Not its magnificent ability to illuminate. Light and time are not the same thing.

Gravity AND light create time. Gravity is a force that creates constant motion and momentum in space. Galaxies aren't galaxies with no center, nothing to orbit around. The Earth spinning around the sun and rotating on an axis is what makes time go.

The illustrations earlier were about the speed of light and light's density. Light is so powerful gravity cannot contain it. The sun radiates light while being able to sustain a gravitational pull on all these planets. Light is more like a measurement.

If a planet that is trillions and trillions of miles away put a telescope on Earth to see what it was up to it would see Earth not of today, but of a looooong time ago. Or if you sat on the sun with a telescope and a walkie talkie and asked a girl to flicker her light on you would see this happen until 8 minutes later. Cos it took the light 8 minutes to get to you. I that respect, viewing Earth from the sun would be like being 8 minutes in the past.

[BigJohnson]

If I were to take my eyes out I still wouldn't be able to see the stars yet that doesn't mean things aren't still there.

This is true! But even if you had eyes still, you won't be able to see a star who's light hadn't reached you yet. Its still traveling through time! From your point of view, the star is many years in the past, and from the stars point of view your many years in the past.

Whats to stop light from traveling faster than it does? Why does it always travel at the same speed from any source? You'd figure, in a different setting for time, when a light turns on you'd be able to see it instantly, from anywhere. The idea that light has to travel at a given speed raises lots of questions.

But there is a point in all this, we as observers determine what the reality is and most of the time we use light to determine what that reality is. Thigs an observer cannot see never become real, they're only potential. But I think that we are in touch with far things because of quantistic entanglement with all the matter in the universe, and we don't need light lo know things are out there actually.

I agree completely. If higher dimensions are not bound by time. To me, this means these dimensions allude time as well as light, as WE see it.


I knew they had one of the biggest particle accelerator down there at the CERN, is that what you mean?

Yes they were saying it has potential to make very small black wholes. People are trying to sue them because they fear the small black whole will get larger when it starts to feed on matter. lol Could you imagine if it just kept growing and growing..

[L.A. Tripp]

Ramm . . . "theoreticaly . . . shown"? Doesn't that contradict itself? lol.

Johnson, light actually doesn't always travel at the same speed. It has been found that light slows down.

[azazels_wolf]

RAMM:

I'm a bit rushed right now (sorry), but if I remember correctly, this video explains the idea of consciousness underlying the quantum field:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrcWntw9juM

Regarding the speed of light:
This was the first experiment that broke the speed of light, I don't know if it is still considered valid:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/3303699/We-have-broken-speed-of-light.html

And here's the wikipedia article on Faster-than-light theories:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faster-than-light

[RAMM]

Yes they were saying it has potential to make very small black wholes. People are trying to sue them because they fear the small black whole will get larger when it starts to feed on matter. lol Could you imagine if it just kept growing and growing..

Their argument is that the black hole does not get large by itself, but gets as large as the energy they put into it, and since all the energy on earth would still not be big enough to make a decent black hole then there's no danger.
But that's probably not 100% true. There probably is a point where the black hole would start sucking matter by itself and get larger and potentially suck in the whole solar sistem. But still I don't think the kind of energy we have is enough to get to that no return point.

Ramm . . . "theoreticaly . . . shown"? Doesn't that contradict itself? lol.

Johnson, light actually doesn't always travel at the same speed. It has been found that light slows down.

Theoreticly shown I mean, you cannot practically show that something cannot be done. You can't make an experiment that shows something is impossible to do. But, from the formulas(which are theoretical) it can be infered that light cannot travel faser than that particular speed.

Light slows down as it passes through matter. I don't think it actually slows down, it might just have to "move around" gassy atoms and thus travel a longer distance, which makes it look like it went slower.

Azazel, I'm going to sleep and tomorrow I'll look at those links and investigate that stuff.. I think there might be other explenations for those phenomena..
If there was a way for things to travel faster than light, the whole relativity theory would crumble, and maybe also the quantum mechanics would be in trouble and we'd have to change everything. There's either a flow in these theories, or something else happens in those experiments.

[BigJohnson]

Ramm . . . "theoreticaly . . . shown"? Doesn't that contradict itself? lol.

Johnson, light actually doesn't always travel at the same speed. It has been found that light slows down.

In space, time travels at the same speed always. Things like water can slow it down but I'm only talking about light traveling through pure space.

[BigJohnson]

Their argument is that the black hole does not get large by itself, but gets as large as the energy they put into it, and since all the energy on earth would still not be big enough to make a decent black hole then there's no danger.
But that's probably not 100% true. There probably is a point where the black hole would start sucking matter by itself and get larger and potentially suck in the whole solar sistem. But still I don't think the kind of energy we have is enough to get to that no return point.

LOL they are trying so smash particles together to try and recreate a "mini big bang" to see how matter is created. Its an interesting idea but the black whole it could create would only need a fraction of a gram of matter to start growing. I would imagine they would create it in a very sterile environment.

[L.A. Tripp]

I don't currently have proof of this, but I think I've heard that time has been found to be slowing down as well.

[RAMM]

I don't currently have proof of this, but I think I've heard that time has been found to be slowing down as well.

More or less so.
It depends on the observer. If the observer is internal to the system then time doesn't slow down or speed up.
But for the external observer of a system time can be different.
It involves speed relative to the speed of light, and also gravity.
For example, moving towards the center of a black hole time would be slowing down.
Moving at a very high speed, almost the speed of light, time would be very slow for you, and the world outside would seem like moving way faster, so you can go to the future in less time than just letting it pass.

Also, when a people is running even at a human speed, time moves a tiny bit slower for him than for a person standing nearby. But the difference would be insignificantly small. One would have to travel at many thousands of miles per second to actually make a tangible difference.

It has also be shown that inside crop circles, time is moving at a different speed than outside it. Crop circles probably involve something like electromagnetic energy.

Qi/ki/prana/kundalini/life force can also affect time and space and matter in many interesting ways. Consciousness is what controls that energy into changing our environment.

[BigJohnson]

Qi/ki/prana/kundalini/life force can also affect time and space and matter in many interesting ways. Consciousness is what controls that energy into changing our environment.

Its amazing, becoming present is pure utilization of time. Consciousness is the ultimate observer. From what we have observed from the universe consciousness is a fluke of a phenomena and is rather "godly." I just had a thought, distance!

Say I'm present on Earth, and some other dude/thing is present on a planet really far away at the same time. Technically we are both present in that exact moment BUT the time gap would only become apparent if I were to try and get a glimpse of his planet, or if he were to try to catch a glimpse of Earth ya know? Distance would make it appear as though we are both in the "past." So if we were to travel to that planet fast enough or dematerialize and rematerialized it would be just like going into the future! :eek: Or really, catching up with the present time.

[RAMM]

BJ, I dunno if you're familiar with the concept of Quantum Entanglement.
Anyway, it seems tha the whole universe is made of one single elementary particle. Actually the entire matter is made of this one particle.
The dimensions and time make it look to us as separate but actually, the matter we're made of is only an illusion. We think there are a quantity of electrons in the universe but there's only ona actually.

This also means that WE ARE EVERYWHERE. The matter your body is made, and that of which my body is made of is the same matter. So in order so speak telepathicly i would only need a way to make my attoms vibrate in a certain way and your attoms would vibrate at the exact same time in the exact same way even though you're at the other end of the universe. Thus a message is sent. Also when deeply present, the sense of oneity with the whole universe does actually come from this. You don't have to go in the future or move to that other planet in order to feel united with tha extraterestrial being up there. You instantly connect with it once you're able to. Time and space introduce perceived multitude and movement and evolution.
Experiemnts have shown that information can be sent instantly over ANY distance, and is not related to speed.

[L.A. Tripp]

Two things . . . have you guys heard of the atomic clocks? There have been experiments done with them regarding time and the speed of time.

Also, if you send vibrations to one other person . . . what keeps every other person in the world from feeling those same vibrations at the same moment?

[RAMM]

Also, if you send vibrations to one other person . . . what keeps every other person in the world from feeling those same vibrations at the same moment?

Mine is an over-simplified model of this thing. Just for one to keep in mind what's in the field of possible. I don't know the math of it, it's acqually very complicated, and they're still working on some of the answers.
One simple answer is PERSPECTIVE. Do you know about entangled electrons and what they have been shown to do in laboratory experiments?

When I send an email it goes like into the whole internet but not everybody can read it, just the person it's supposed to receive it. I don't have a clear idea of how this whole thing works but i know it doesn't fail so it must work somehow.
Though we are one, we also have something unique to eachother. Our personal way of being present or conscious. That's sort of our IP i guess :D
Actually those "vibrations"(which probably aren't vibrations, but just to simplify this concept) go to every atom of the universe thus to any person on this planet. And supposedly everyone could pick on them if they had the ability supposedly. Yogis have been known to entertain these types of relationships over distances across the planet. They sort'of got their own enlightenment forum out there for anyone to read, we just need to get connected :D

[BigJohnson]

BJ, I dunno if you're familiar with the concept of Quantum Entanglement.
Anyway, it seems tha the whole universe is made of one single elementary particle. Actually the entire matter is made of this one particle.
The dimensions and time make it look to us as separate but actually, the matter we're made of is only an illusion. We think there are a quantity of electrons in the universe but there's only ona actually.

I'm not familiar with it but his really does make sense. I do believe every form of matter has a common bond.

This also means that WE ARE EVERYWHERE. The matter your body is made, and that of which my body is made of is the same matter. So in order so speak telepathicly i would only need a way to make my attoms vibrate in a certain way and your attoms would vibrate at the exact same time in the exact same way even though you're at the other end of the universe. Thus a message is sent. Also when deeply present, the sense of oneity with the whole universe does actually come from this. You don't have to go in the future or move to that other planet in order to feel united with tha extraterestrial being up there. You instantly connect with it once you're able to. Time and space introduce perceived multitude and movement and evolution.
Experiemnts have shown that information can be sent instantly over ANY distance, and is not related to speed.

Damn that's pretty cool. Would you consider this force or ability to send information that of another dimension? If it isn't bound to the ideas of speed it must not travel at all right. Since we are all one, in this mode of perspective my thoughts are your thoughts, its just a matter of connecting them?

[RAMM]

Damn that's pretty cool. Would you consider this force or ability to send information that of another dimension? If it isn't bound to the ideas of speed it must not travel at all right. Since we are all one, in this mode of perspective my thoughts are your thoughts, its just a matter of connecting them?
Exactly, nothing can go beyond the speed of light, but information can be transfered over any disance insantly this way.


I'm not familiar with it but his really does make sense. I do believe every form of matter has a common bond.
I need to explain to you wha entanglement is actually. It's not a "bond" being set among matter. It's deeper than that.

They found what we call "entangled electrons" where one was like in europe and the second one was in the U.S. and they noticed tha when they did something to alterate some characteristic of one of them, the other one would display the same thing instantly. For example they gave more energy to one, and the other one got the same exact amount of energy but instantly which seemed impossible.
They realized they didn't have TWO ELECTRONS, they had one single electron in two places. It is shown that an object can be in two places at the same time. But it's actually one single object.
But going way bellow simple particles, they are also made of even smaller particles. According to this theory there is an infinitely small particle that is the building brick of the entire matter, and that is only one single particle, displaced in many places, just like entangled electrons. So acually the whole universe is one single elementary particle. So what you do now has a deep effect on the whole universe, we are just out of touch with that.
It's actually the multitude of dimentions that make one thing look like many things in many places, but places are dimentions and they're illusions.
The entangled electron probably was connected to itself in the 4th dimention or higher, so from there you would see just one electron. But in 3D they look like 2 distinct objects.
I fugure this is what they mean when they say separation is an illusion, we are all one with each other and with the whole universe. It's indeed a scientific fact.
They're also trying to use this technology in supercomputers.. I'm curious to see how that works out..

[BigJohnson]

I need to explain to you wha entanglement is actually. It's not a "bond" being set among matter. It's deeper than that.

They found what we call "entangled electrons" where one was like in europe and the second one was in the U.S. and they noticed tha when they did something to alterate some characteristic of one of them, the other one would display the same thing instantly. For example they gave more energy to one, and the other one got the same exact amount of energy but instantly which seemed impossible.
They realized they didn't have TWO ELECTRONS, they had one single electron in two places. It is shown that an object can be in two places at the same time. But it's actually one single object.
But going way bellow simple particles, they are also made of even smaller particles. According to this theory there is an infinitely small particle that is the building brick of the entire matter, and that is only one single particle, displaced in many places, just like entangled electrons. So acually the whole universe is one single elementary particle. So what you do now has a deep effect on the whole universe, we are just out of touch with that.
It's actually the multitude of dimentions that make one thing look like many things in many places, but places are dimentions and they're illusions.
The entangled electron probably was connected to itself in the 4th dimention or higher, so from there you would see just one electron. But in 3D they look like 2 distinct objects.
I fugure this is what they mean when they say separation is an illusion, we are all one with each other and with the whole universe. It's indeed a scientific fact.
They're also trying to use this technology in supercomputers.. I'm curious to see how that works out..

Ooohhh man I see what you are saying. A bond would be two SEPARATE entities with one or more attributes in common. While entanglement implies that we are all at the core the same down to the smallest atom, while seemingly "separate" to the senses. The senses merely an evolved way to "cope" with our surroundings and perception of this specific dimension.

So it in a way validates a "big bang" type theory. An immensely dense yet small piece of matter comprised of EVERYTHING that exists now, exploding and expanding through out the universe.

Fascinating! :D

[RAMM]

:)
I believe it explains many things like gravity, but I don't know how yet..
So the big bang created dimentions, not matter in a sense..