Banning Babygirl

[Limelight]

Hey guys,

was it really necessary to ban Babygirl and Tony Montana? I mean you guys started this whole thing with the preface not to censor at all.

Needless to say that there were a lot of flaming going on between them and the sinister sixx guys but isn't it a little bit one sided to just ban them?

It was you who said that you don't want to become another TMM Forum but now it just looks like that.

At least BG was one of the few members who contributed a lot to this forum. Whereas others just flamed...

Even though it's your forum I still think it's unfair...

[-Silver-]

Go read his posts. Yes he had great advice, yes he has good game and people will readily give testimonies to that. But if anyone criticised his style, he would insult them badly, and claim they had bad game for not agreeing with him. But most of all, he made far too many comments and posts claiming that MM is 'full of crap' and that his method is the best method. Even I pointed out to him several times that it's all a matter of opinion, not a fact, but he just refused to listen. As far as I know this is exactly what happened on the other forums he was banned from. If he agreed to accept constructive critiscism, acknowledge that MM actually works for the guys on this forum, and stop promoting his own method, then I would love to have him back. But before he arrived here the flaming was almost non-existent, and he was involved in every single flaming thread.

As far as Tony Montana goes, I have no idea why he was banned as I have been too busy to be active over the last week or two. But I'm sure there was a very good reason and the mods believed he was harming the forum like BG. But like I said with BG, if he can agree to sort out his internet-personality problems, then there's no reason he shouldn't be allowed back. Don't think the mods banned these guys for the hell of it, BG imparticular had it coming. Do a search for his posts if you find it hard to believe.

-Silver-

[relics]

I thought this was another flame thread. I didn't even know he got banned.


BG I was okay with. I'm fine sifting through the crap and finding actual value in his posts.

Montana was just a prick.

[Intrigue]

I just read over an old BG post. He called Rewok an "absolute FUCKING MORON". Then went on to say why we should read his posts. The forum is a better place with him there etc...This behavior is not acceptable IMO. I don't know Rewok or BG but I wouldn't find any reason to call either of them morons.

Personally I'm not glad he was banned, I just wish he could've toned it down a bit...and we could have him posting stuff perhaps more helpful. Guy obviously has a chip on his shoulder, maybe we can give him another chance?

[Vincent Chase]

Not fair? When was the last time something negative arose on this forum and it wasn't connected to him?

I don't know the guy and I would never try to invalidate someones game, so based on his behavior alone, he took it upon himself to be "reactive" and attack everyone who alluded to anything negative associated with him, and it would spawn fanatic behavior from lackeys.

If the dude is willing to be personable, then I have nothing against him, nor him coming back. However, if he brings his negativity miasma with him, I agree with VAs choice. Just like I stand by my choice at TMM when he violated the terms of agreement.

[Heartwork]

lets not make the same mistakes, in fact, I am just going to PM you my reasons and hopefully show you some truth on the matter.

[Limelight]

Guys you got me all wrong. It's not about wether he deserved it or not(he did along with some other guys) it's about The VA saying that they won't censor/ban anybody. I mean they said it's a UNMODERATED forum...

If it's not than sticky the rules...

Besides that it always takes two to tango...

[sting]

If i'm not mistaken - babygirl and montana were banned for advertising too much, not indulging in flaming.

the VA forum leaders have been more than very tolerant of his hard edge, and many other peoples, too.

Woodhaven used to suggest alternative models, theories etc. to MM/RSD, when that was the accepted fashion of the day, but he did so with courtesty and respect.
Good manners cost nothing - even on internet seduction boards.
BG had value to offer (i suspect some of it was 'ticked up' a bit - but i don't think it was pure BSing) - but he went about offering it in a self-sabatoging way.

almost everything in Lovedrop's 'Violation Theory' is demonstrated in B.G's posting career on this forum. both what he wrote - and the reactions he elicted from others.
Not cool - but it was tolerated.

The flagrant marketting crossed a line - you don't walk into McDonalds and start yelling at the top of your voice how crappy it is and how much better your place is ("psst...here's the address").

[Showcase]

I personally believe both banned parties were compromising the quality of the forum. Almost every thread created seemed to turn into a flame fest. This forum is for people to help eachother with self improvement in the Venusian Arts.

[Goatie]

I personal believe both banned parties were compromising the quality of the forum. Almost every thread created seemed to turn into a flame fest. This forum is for people to help eachother with self improvement in the Venusian Arts.

I agree. (Needless to say in future I won't be contributing to the problem)

[666]

almost everything in Lovedrop's 'Violation Theory' is demonstrated in B.G's posting career on this forum. both what he wrote - and the reactions he elicted from others.

Not cool - but it was tolerated.

The flagrant marketting crossed a line - you don't walk into McDonalds and start yelling at the top of your voice how crappy it is and how much better your place is ("psst...here's the address").



Man, I remember I loved the article when I first read it. Thanks for reminding that there's some awesome material to be found here on the VA - everyone should go check out Lovedrop's masterpiece.

It should be read, re-read, read out loud, internalised, made into a desktop wallpaper and proposed as the US of A's newest amendment ... :o

[Orleans]

Frankly, in my opinion, the guy offered absolutely 0 value that hasn't been written about before and better.

His game consists of running around shirtless or in wifebeaters and having women fawn over his body while he dances like a retard. Posting pictures and videos of yourself on Myspace might be great if you look like a model but for the below average or even average looking guy it's not going to do shit. Congrats buddy you've got the looks but that's not something you can teach students. It's bullshit like this that corrodes at the foundation of this industry, the only question is whether he's a guy looking to scam or if he actually believes he has a system he can teach guys.

Beyond that, his incessant flaming was just pushing new and experienced guys away from this forum. His name is fitting, he sure cries and bitches like a baby girl.

Good riddance, he's been banned everywhere else. It's just a natural progression that he be exiled from this forum.

[wanderer]

You can get alot of value out if his posts but he was being a dick most of the time.

[666]

Guys, let's cut the crap and move on.

Does anyone wanna talk about pick-up lines? I've opened with a "Stop doing that okay?... *sly smile* I'm not a piece of meat you know." today. Worked pretty well with the commuting ladies.

[Rocco]

For those of you who are really wondering why Tony Montana and Baby Girl were banned here is the thread:

http://www.venusianarts.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1838

the posts of Tony Montana and Baby Girl that caused this are edited by Prophet. I read them before edited and was surprised how hard Tony Montana was not just flaming ***** but insulting him in a very bad, mean and undeserved way and I don't want to quote the insults. In the next post Baby Girl was "congratulating" Tony Montany for doing that and "laughing" at the whole issue.

I think there should be some limits, and insulting and/or flaming an instructor is one of them.

[Greystoke]

Even though it's your forum I still think it's unfair...

You are entitled to your opinion. Life's unfair. Deal with it.

Tony Montana was ADVERTISING Baby Girl's new forum and actively encouraging aPUAs away from the VA forums towards his company and BG method. And actively showing contempt for Mystery, his method and his crew.

And they were both posting like MAD(more than 7 posts per day on average)... monopolising attention and using the forum for their own anti-MM propaganda. I am surprised BG was banned earlier. I guess that Matador/Prophet wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Before his ban from VA, Baby Girl got himself banned from TMM, RSD, theLSS(where he initially posted) and probably other lesser forums where his unrespectful attitude has not been tolerated.

[Satan]

Baby girl hahahhaa there's a joke for you. From what I've heard he gets the odd average girl, not bad for a male model :rolleyes:. This guy is a con artist and everyone is starting to realise that now. Props to VA for the ban...many people will be saved from this hustler.

I don't understand why so many of these weirdos are running bootcamps. Leave it to the professioanls before the police get onto you.

Satan

[Goatie]

Baby girl hahahhaa there's a joke for you. From what I've heard he gets the odd average girl, not bad for a male model :rolleyes:. This guy is a con artist and everyone is starting to realise that now. Props to VA for the ban...many people will be saved from this hustler.

I don't understand why so many of these weirdos are running bootcamps. Leave it to the professioanls before the police get onto you.

Satan

Makes sense. LOL Nice one.

[Pulse]

I am glad to see both gone.

[Matador]

We had our reasons for this including, but not limited to IP/Security Issues, blatent advertising, and something that bothered me the most is blatent disrepect of one my instructors.

To all of you. I have respect for everyone in my organization. They are not being paid to post here. I have team meetings and motivate my guys to post as they are juggling their full-time jobs. ***** is a top-notch instructor, freaky good, and wants to give back...he actually never mentioned anything to me about the matter. My forum admin team brought it to my attention.

You can disagree with me, LD, even Mystery...you can disagree with my instructors...all I ask is that you be civil & respectful about it.

If you do not show respect on this forum, this forum will not show respect to you.

If you think you can sit here and abuse this boards, my instructors, our friends under the VA Credo of free speech...you're mistaken.

I think you all know what I mean. You give some people an inch and they take a mile. People have to try to push it to see where the limits are and BG and TM did just that.

[Matador]

Hey guys,

was it really necessary to ban Babygirl and Tony Montana? I mean you guys started this whole thing with the preface not to censor at all.

Needless to say that there were a lot of flaming going on between them and the sinister sixx guys but isn't it a little bit one sided to just ban them?

It was you who said that you don't want to become another TMM Forum but now it just looks like that.

At least BG was one of the few members who contributed a lot to this forum. Whereas others just flamed...

Even though it's your forum I still think it's unfair...


We had our reasons for this including, but not limited to IP/Security Issues, blatent advertising, and something that bothered me the most is blatent disrepect of one my instructors.

To all of you. I have respect for everyone in my organization. They are not being paid to post here. I have team meetings and motivate my guys to post as they are juggling their full-time jobs.

Do you like the VA Q&A Threads? How do you think they get there? I talk the instructors to take time out of their schedule away from their full-time jobs to make time for you guys and be active all throughout the forum....and someone has the audacity to insult them?

***** is a top-notch instructor, freaky good, and wants to give back...he actually never mentioned anything to me about the matter. My forum admin team brought it to my attention, and I took action without his knowledge or consent.

You can disagree with me...you can disagree with my instructors...all I ask is that you be civil & respectful about it.

If you do not show respect on this forum, this forum will not show respect to you.

If you think you can sit here and abuse this boards, my instructors, our friends under the VA Credo of free speech...you're mistaken.

I think you all know what I mean. You give some people an inch and they take a mile. People have to try to push it to see where the limits are and BG and TM did just that.

Let's talk about this "blatent advertising" issue.

If you guys post a value-added thread with you're url at the bottom...i'll let it slide.

If you post a full-page ad of motorola pagers & "my new seduction 3000 method", while saying fuck VA, fuck RSD, even fuck TMM....and demonstrate a total lack of common sense...then please leave...I don't want you here.

In all fairness, we will posting forum guidlines, so everyone knows what is clear and what will get them banned or reprimanded...I hate sounding like a principal, but otherwise, this will turn into the wild-wild west.

Not to single out BG & TM, but they were brought to my attention and I made a decision...there may be others that have slipped through the rader...good for you...don't want to ban you anyway...let's stay positive going forward.

[Durexlw]

You can disagree with me...you can disagree with my instructors...all I ask is that you be civil & respectful about it.

If you do not show respect on this forum, this forum will not show respect to you.
Respect... and I'm glad someone stepped foreward to take some action.
The guys that got banned were probably fine persons, but they were filling up a dedicated forum to a point where it was hard to find material relevant to this forum. That's over the top if you ask me. I'm glad it got stopped and to his own material, it'll start to shine when he keeps it on his own dedicated forum.

I believe bolth parties will benefit from this action.

[Mild_Seven]

I think it was a good move. Matador and everybody have always done a great job of letting the board function organically and never got involved in things until all this crazy shit happened. Babygirl was using this board to promote his own method on numerous threads every day, while VA pays the bills. They probably would have let him keep doing it if he didn't insult Mystery's method and by extension all of its practitioners on this forum.

Cutting down Mystery on his home turf is a pretty stupid business idea. Anybody with half a brain would come here and try to portray his method as compatible with or supplemental to Mystery's stuff.

[Limelight]

Everything has been explained. Lets move on.

[harvest]

sticking up for your guys..like that move :cool:

[relics]

Leader of men, protector of loved ones


...oosh I'm creaming in my pants:)

[Satan]

If you post a full-page ad of motorola pagers & "my new seduction 3000 method", while saying fuck VA, fuck RSD, even fuck TMM....and demonstrate a total lack of common sense...then please leave...I don't want you here.


Exactly...

Stay away from baby girl, he'll be in the news papers soon for running a con...mark my words.

Satan

[Greystoke]

Exactly...

Stay away from baby girl, he'll be in the news papers soon for running a con...mark my words.

Satan

Did nobody find this slightly amusing, esp coming from a user named Satan? :)

[dr gonzo]

We had our reasons for this including, but not limited to IP/Security Issues


Could you elaborate on that please?


make time for you guys and be active all throughout the forum....and someone has the audacity to insult them?


I've looked back through Baby Girls posts and I can't see a thread where he insulted one of your guys - do you happen to remember the name of the thread?

Gonzo

[Greystoke]

Could you elaborate on that please?



I've looked back through Baby Girls posts and I can't see a thread where he insulted one of your guys - do you happen to remember the name of the thread?

Gonzo

He insulted many people here, Gonzo. And if you are here to advertise his forum, you will be banned too.

He and montana insulted ***** but their posts were edited out, out of respect for the rest of us so that we dont have to read their flaming. What a bunch of baboons!

[dr gonzo]

He insulted many people here, Gonzo. And if you are here to advertise his forum, you will be banned too.


I'm here because I'm curious as to what got him banned.


He and montana insulted ***** but their posts were edited out, out of respect for the rest of us so that we dont have to read their flaming. What a bunch of baboons!

Well that remains to be seen - I'd like to know exactly what got him banned. It seems to be in fashion lately to ban the guys who give the most to a lot of these forums.

I am genuinely curious here - what did he say and what was the context?

Gonzo
http://babygirlmethod.proboards92.com/

[IceDragon]

Baby Girl was constantly flamed by certain members here, and as far as I know, all he did was defend himself.

As far as offending VA instructors goes, I am not aware of that, so I can't comment. If he did that, then it was clearly the wrong thing to do.

However, I think this forum, and the others are a poorer place, as they are missing a guy who gave so much value, and spent so much time helping the guys who needed it the most.

IceDragon :)

[dr gonzo]

Baby Girl was constantly flamed by certain members here, and as far as I know, all he did was defend himself.

As far as offending VA instructors goes, I am not aware of that, so I can't comment. If he did that, then it was clearly the wrong thing to do.

However, I think this forum, and the others are a poorer place, as they are missing a guy who gave so much value, and spent so much time helping the guys who needed it the most.

IceDragon :)

Hi IceDragon,

Yes, I suspected as much.

I would be interested to see what it was that was actually said between him and the instructor.

All the forums that have banned him have lost a lot - I think that is pretty obvious to everyone except a vocal few who don't like what he has to say.

Gonzo
http://babygirlmethod.proboards92.com/

[Orleans]

They decided to rip into ***** in the Unreactiveness thread. I read it before it was editted and I 100% agree with Matador that action needed to be taken.

[CrimsonKing]

Did we really loose that much value?

All I ever saw from Baby Girl was outlandish field reports which advocated direct game and subsequently turned into flame wars whenever someone questioned his method, posts about how MM was flawed and how his direct game was better, threads made solely for the purpose of attacking other members, and obviously fake impersonations of users made to make the real user look bad.

And do we really want to take advice from someone who doesn't get it when an entire forum tells him to stop flaming? That's not exactly socially intelligent.

It seemed to me like the only reason he was here was to post field reports showing how amazing his Baby Girl Method was for the purpose of generating interest in his e-book and bootcamps. Which also explains why he was on a MM forum talking about how MM was flawed and direct game (RE: Baby Girl Method) was the only real way to get women. It also explains why he was so quick to flame other users when they questioned his method/skills: he needed to defend his own credibility. I always examine a person's motivation for why a person would say or do certain things, and from what I saw of Baby Girl, all he was doing on this forum was advocating his own method/products and attacking anything that threadened what his value.

And all Tony Montana ever seemed to do was defend Baby Girl and his method by either flaming users that flamed Baby Girl, or by talking about what an amazingly cool and nice guy he was. I also remember a post or two paralleling Baby Girl to Mystery when he was first starting out. I found that to be a little too much qualifying for my tastes.

And most importantly: since they were both banned, how much flaming has there been on this board? Almost none. Now, there were plenty of others that were flaming right along with BG and TM, but I highly doubt that if they had been banned and BG and TM were allowed to stay, that the flaming would have stopped.


Also, I hope I'm not the only one that thinks that Dr Gonzo is OBVIOUSLY Baby Girl trying to garner sympathy for himself and advertise his own forum.

[666]

It (is) was like watching The O'Reilly Factor on Fox News. He said he only once told his guests to shut up disregarding the guest's opposing point of view. Oh, and he's never wrong too.

Those who've watched this show with fascination (and pity) know what it's about.

[Greystoke]

Also, I hope I'm not the only one that thinks that Dr Gonzo is OBVIOUSLY Baby Girl trying to garner sympathy for himself and advertise his own forum.

If Baby Girl has been banned, then he may try to register another account to get back in.

Or he is using a lackey to do his dirty poop job to advertise.

[Vedran]

Doesn't matter what the hell happens...there is always going to be discention within the community between members. Banning and weeding out the crap will continue, so the only thing you guys should do is just fucking deal with it or keep complaining, which hopefully you won't. Here's the wishful thinking.

[Q-Pid]

"The only fool bigger than the person who knows it all is the person who argues with him."
-Stainslaw Jerszy Lec

Wise words. Appropriate eh? :D

[Vedran]

You're reading too much into it, bub.

[Q-Pid]

snikt snikt

[TruePlayer]

Unless someone is spamming the board so bad that it becomes inoperable, I don't see why there is a need to ban anyone: People can just ignore those they don't like.

Sure BG advertised his own board, which is a bit of a no-no. But I think a warning/lecture/temporary suspension would have been sufficient to deal with that.

[Greystoke]

Unless someone is spamming the board so bad that it becomes inoperable, I don't see why there is a need to ban anyone: People can just ignore those they don't like.

Sure BG advertised his own board, which is a bit of a no-no. But I think a warning/lecture/temporary suspension would have been sufficient to deal with that.

Read Matador's explanation for why he was banned.

[dr gonzo]

Did we really loose that much value?


What you've lost is one of the best guys with women you will ever meet or correspond with who offered a shitload of excellent advice on how to get better with women for absolutely no cost. On a forum that is about how to get better with women, that's an absolute fucking disgrace.


And do we really want to take advice from someone who doesn't get it when an entire forum tells him to stop flaming? That's not exactly socially intelligent.


It's pretty hard not to come out vocally against fakery, plastic man syndrome and all the other bullshit that gets spoken around here when you've seen that there's a better way to do this stuff. I wouldn't call it flaming at all.


I also remember a post or two paralleling Baby Girl to Mystery when he was first starting out. I found that to be a little too much qualifying for my tastes.


What the fuck? Why is that about "qualifying" - it is about contrasting one method of doing stuff with another.


Also, I hope I'm not the only one that thinks that Dr Gonzo is OBVIOUSLY Baby Girl trying to garner sympathy for himself and advertise his own forum.

You really are deluded aren't you? You think Baby is the only guy out there who gets it? I take it as a compliment though that you might think I was him - if I could add half the value in what I contribute to these forums that he does, I'd be very proud.

Gonzo

[VitaBrevis]

I take it as a compliment though that you might think I was him - if I could add half the value in what I contribute to these forums that he does, I'd be very proud.
Oh, I don't know - you're doing a pretty good job in hair-trigger flaming anyone who doesn't happen to agree with your point of view. In that respect you're exactly like BG and you should be very proud.

[Parnelli]

What you've lost is one of the best guys with women you will ever meet or correspond with who offered a shitload of excellent advice on how to get better with women for absolutely no cost. On a forum that is about how to get better with women, that's an absolute fucking disgrace.




hey gonz, this is not meant in ill, i would regret if it was taken that way, but considering the content of the post, i accept the risk.

I don't mind reading babygirls posts, and I thought the monolog of simple-statements on his myspace page was pretty darn clever.

But some of his field reports read like a how-to guide for shattering the confidence of new-guys who really need to build their confidence. heavy sex talk in the mall? stalking some lady after she tells you to fk off? A restraining order is not an entirely improbable outcome from behavior like that. Neither is a bad reputation if you live in a small town (small towns really call for generally good and proper conduct). I am not a guru of anything, but i've been alive for a while, and i've seen 31 flavors girls who are into guys, and the girl in that dancing vid sure as chit doesn't look like she's into the dancing dude. And, frankly, when cross-referenced with my experiences in life, i am skeptical about most of his "field reports".

I don't think the err of the moderators was one of excess, but of restraint.

I, for one, hope that the VA crew attains whatever success of $$ or "fame" from their forthcoming publicity barrage, and I would encourage them to not underrate the importance of a forum like this one. If 100,000 people come to your site to take a look at what you have to offer, then 30,000 people (at least) will browse these boards.

And when they see something like "MM is immoral" with quasi-sensible reasons given, and they see the VA crew not defending themselves, they won't percieve it as "wow, the VA crew must be really confident, they don't even bother to defend themselves". This is not a bar, this is not a party, there aren't real people here. People tend to read and think through things they aren't actively involved in far, far more than they do in real life situations.

They will already have that question - is something like this "wrong" - and answering it or not answering it will be an important part of whether they do or don't. VA should accept that the methodical and somewhat clinical nature of Mystery's theories (as outlined in "The Mystery Method", which i read not long ago) leaves you somewhat vulnerable to this sort of attack.

And VA should defend themselves here, in public, where all the world may read after your VH1 show hits. And they should (i know time is hard to find, but, guys, there are potentially millions of $$$ at stake here if handled properly), cast yourselves in a positive light. Steer threads away from bragging and towards something constructive. etc.

$.02, and that's all

[blackjack]

You can say what you want, BG had game. He obviously has success with women by using his technique. BUT I sense a great lack of inner game in him. Well... it's either a lack of inner game or just trying too hard. I'm sure he beleives he's a very confident person, but somehow he has crossed the line from being confident and being arrogant. He was trying so hard to be Alpha that he became Oppressing. You can see that by the way he was defending his method and busting on MM.

Also, I think he came here to validate himself. He probably games women in order to satisfy his need of validation. When I first read his posts, it was like... why is he bragging so much about his success and not saying exactly the backside thinking of his actions... He was posting so much because he needs people to say to him you are great.

Obviously he wants to be good. But he is not doing it the right way. You cannot get to the top by running over everybody, the true way to get to the top is when others push you there. For example Mystery has been ranked (or is ranked I don't keep track of that) the world's greatest pickup artist. Did he run over anyone to get there? I don't think so... he came into the community, shared his knowledge with other and made tons of guy profit from this and then the community put him at the top.

To sum up, I think he has some personnality issues he needs to work on. He must learn to accept the different beliefs of other people, be able to take criticism and learn to respect others. Are we better off without him? Yes and No. His game had another perspective to the game wich is always good to have but he was not a person of quality. Overall I guess we win at not having such a person on this forum.

[666]

I was surprised when one of the threads got Hypnotica's attention.

You can have tight game but your inner game determines your status in the long term. Mystery's modelled Anthony Robbins. Mehow, David D and Style have worked with Steve P and Hypnotica. Almost every dating guru is a bit of an NLP freak. Inner Game is the foundation of the outer game.

'Work on the hearts and minds of others' as Robert Green would say. Ignore the hearts and minds of others, talk about yourself and be eager to impose your willpower and prejudices....

... and people will grow to hate you. That's human nature.

[relics]

You can have thousands of beautiful women, but if you can't get the respect of your bros, where are you really at?

As the wise Michael Scott once put it


Bro’s before ho’s. Why? Because your bro’s are always there for you. They’ve got your back after your ho rips your heart out for no good reason. And you were nothing but great to your ho. And you told her that she was the only ho for you and that she was better than all the other ho’s in the world. And then…and then suddenly she’s not your ho no mo’.

[Greystoke]

You can say what you want, BG had game. He obviously has success with women by using his technique. BUT I sense a great lack of inner game in him. Well... it's either a lack of inner game or just trying too hard. I'm sure he beleives he's a very confident person, but somehow he has crossed the line from being confident and being arrogant. He was trying so hard to be Alpha that he became Oppressing. You can see that by the way he was defending his method and busting on MM.

Also, I think he came here to validate himself. He probably games women in order to satisfy his need of validation. When I first read his posts, it was like... why is he bragging so much about his success and not saying exactly the backside thinking of his actions... He was posting so much because he needs people to say to him you are great.

Obviously he wants to be good. But he is not doing it the right way. You cannot get to the top by running over everybody, the true way to get to the top is when others push you there. For example Mystery has been ranked (or is ranked I don't keep track of that) the world's greatest pickup artist. Did he run over anyone to get there? I don't think so... he came into the community, shared his knowledge with other and made tons of guy profit from this and then the community put him at the top.

To sum up, I think he has some personnality issues he needs to work on. He must learn to accept the different beliefs of other people, be able to take criticism and learn to respect others. Are we better off without him? Yes and No. His game had another perspective to the game wich is always good to have but he was not a person of quality. Overall I guess we win at not having such a person on this forum.

That's the best post in the whole thread. Totally agree with you!!!

If you can make Babygirl read this, maybe he will realise the errors of his ways, maybe not.

[Devious]

This thread is already at the top, to bring it up again would be to confirm your affiliation with Baby Girl.

Love,
~d

[Greystoke]

God no! I'd rather f-close five UGs than have any remote affiliation with Baby "i dance like a clown' girl.

Mod/admin,

Lock that thread for good.

Devious,
are you still speaking at the under21 convention?

[Devious]

Hey Greystoke,

No, I decided not to speak at the convention. Some cool guys are going to show, so it should be fun for the attendees, nontheless.

Love,
~d

[Johnny Soporno]

Inner Game is the foundation of the outer game.

biggest misconception in PU, also the KJ mantra.

-Rewok

Lost me, Rewok? Now I'm confused - what is the misconception about which you are speaking?

Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy

P.S. Have you read my definition of Inner Game (http://wwv.themysterymethod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24283)?