PDA

View Full Version : So SICK of Being The Nice Guy...Do I Really Have To Turn Into An Asshole?



reineq
09-13-2008, 03:08 AM
You know, I've read a lot about the Venusian arts and so far, it hasn't been that horrible...but why is it that I appear to be the nice guy way too often? More often than not I would say...and I don't get it...

I neg, I tease, I do everything necessary and they end up loving me as a person, but NOT the 'attractive' sort of love. I can run conversations, sets, and really exert a lot of confidence (public speaking is one of my hobbies), but still, something is wrong, I know it.

Is it because I may be just be a happy guy who makes a lot of jokes? Am I smiling too much? Do I have to turn into an asshole most of the time, should I just test that and find out?

Or is it because, in my day-to-day life, I kind of turn off the 'PickUp' game and turn into the nice guy everyone likes? I still appear confident, no one uses me in real life...so I'm not that kind of nice guy...but I'm a guy that people really don't hate. I really don't feel the need to 'neg' people in my daily life that I'm not attracted to, they seem to respect me a lot but maybe being who I am in my daily life is affecting my game...

I Need your opinions, and appreciate all replies. Thanks a lot

Argo navis
09-13-2008, 03:27 AM
hoohoohahahaha this is hilarious! Pardon my french, at least, know your problem has some positive side effect.


something is wrong, I know it.

Well. Essentially, that is a bit of a problem.
Something IS wrong and you KNOW it, now that's a deeply rooted negative belief about yourself if you ask me.

Then, it's difficult to answer without knowing details. The key is balance and transition, state transition : you may run too much funny, simply, but don't, by any means don't confuse being cocky with being a jerk.

I am not MEAN when I say to a lady... "Ooh, that dress is kind of cute with the 60s feel it gives", I am merely throwing her off balance with a compliment embedding... a neg. She'll be trying to find what I mean, if it's positive or negative.

You can add a dose of funny to the same sentence, it still works as an attractive thing to say, "look, you're a total dork going around dressed up as Mary Poppins".

It's cute : it's not harmful to be a dork who looks like Mary Poppins, it does make fun of her insecurities as a woman who has to look good to men, but it does it a cute way. It also tells you've noticed details, to put it short : it tells her you're "in" and know how it feels to be her in that dress right now, and that you want to have fun with that (her).

Then you can take it way overboard on the cocky side, and go "look, you're a total dork going around with bad clothes like that." That is not fun. That is not cool. That is blunt and agressive and very jerkish and unattractive.

...

I hope it helps you draw a line.

azazels_wolf
09-13-2008, 07:30 AM
Argo is right.

And NO, you absolutely do NOT have to be an asshole or a jerk. Most high value women will simply not put up with an asshole for any length of time. Cocky funny is one thing.... being an asshole is another. And at some point, you will have to drop the cocky funny if you want to go deeper.

There's NOTHING WRONG WITH BEING NICE, as long as you are alpha, assertive, and do NOT take shit from people. Don't be a lap dog. Have your own will and your own opinions and your own life. But don't let that stop you from showing kindness or being nice, EVER, as long as it is genuine.

How far are you getting when you game, and what are you doing when something goes wrong? You need to give us some details if you really want us to pinpoint your difficulty and some possible solutions.

c1Live1
09-13-2008, 08:53 PM
If your an asshole man... you'll end up with asshole women... take it from me, I'm an asshole. No if's and's or but's about it ;)

But ya know what, I'm okay with that... and so are the people in my life. I happen to enjoy the company of other assholes, we get along, it takes a certain caliber of person to be able to hang around me for any given period of time, and those who can bare it, tend to enjoy my company, as I enjoy theirs... Just know your not gonna land as many longterm friends as a "non-asshole" would :D . . . point is, all my close friends are assholes %100, and I love it! Its so much fun for me cuz others will look on at us and think we are just horrible towards eachother, but if you ask any of us, we'll just tell you "thats just the way it is... we dun take it personaly"
So unless you want a bunch of asshole people in your life... dont become an asshole, nuff said ;)

Im also not dumb, I know when to turn it off... but when I do, I'm simply putting on a front, its not the true me.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rN3hVL6vzxM

DateDemon
09-13-2008, 09:40 PM
Usually when a guy is having a problem like this in pick up it is because they subconciously revert to "nice guy mode" every once in a while. You may be negging and teasing and not being the nice guy 80% of the time but if you slip up and show your true nice guy colors 20% of the time you will still be locked into that nice guy zone. You just need to learn to always be in control and to not give in to any shit tests or anything that shows you as needy or just as some boytoy.

Girls test for this all the time. Have you ever heard a girl say "You are trouble!" That's a very good nice guy test, because a lot of guys will tease a girl and neg and all that but when a girl calls them out on it like you are trouble! they will often subconsciously go back to nice guy mode and be like no! no I am really not! and ruin it. That's just one example but just be conscious of not reverting to nice guy mode or giving into her demands

DaveyFresh"
09-14-2008, 12:25 AM
This sounds harsh you don't need to be a fkn asshole all you need to do is show your a nice guy who won't take the bs. Nice guys with there own life are successful Nice guys who are doormats aren't get thy drift? -- TruTh

Fervour
09-14-2008, 07:09 AM
It sounds to me like you're not showing genuine interest in her as a person.
A couple of simple things that can help in this area is...

1) Holding eye contact. Sounds silly, but holding eye contact with a girl is a subtle way she can pick up on the fact that you are interested in her, and it also portrays lots of confidence.

2) Kino. Touch her. If you're not touching her physically she'll assume you either have a girlfriend, or are not interested in her. You absolutely have to be a bit of a touchy feely guy.

Cro
09-15-2008, 10:41 AM
For me the answer is simple, kino more. Run the tightest game in the world without kino....LJBF ensues

Revel
09-15-2008, 11:45 AM
As mentioned first thought on reading your problem, "where's the kino escalation".
Ya might also want to make use of an SOI (one of Jugglers things) It's a statement of interest/intent eg. Wow not only are you sexy you're a good conversationalist.

Demondim
09-16-2008, 12:12 AM
You do not have to be an asshole. Negs are not insults, if you used them that way you would not have gotten positive feedback.

Women dont often put up with assholes. You have to give off a positive, non judgemental vibe. If you judge them and are a tightass why would they hang with you? You neg them to show you dont need them..it gives you plausable deniability for talking with her. Later, in comfort, you show her that she earned your respect etc.

reineq
09-16-2008, 04:03 AM
Usually when a guy is having a problem like this in pick up it is because they subconciously revert to "nice guy mode" every once in a while. You may be negging and teasing and not being the nice guy 80% of the time but if you slip up and show your true nice guy colors 20% of the time you will still be locked into that nice guy zone. You just need to learn to always be in control and to not give in to any shit tests or anything that shows you as needy or just as some boytoy.

This is excellent advice, it could be that I'm subconsciously turning into nice guy too often, I will definitely become more aware of it


It sounds to me like you're not showing genuine interest in her as a person.
A couple of simple things that can help in this area is...

1) Holding eye contact. Sounds silly, but holding eye contact with a girl is a subtle way she can pick up on the fact that you are interested in her, and it also portrays lots of confidence.

2) Kino. Touch her. If you're not touching her physically she'll assume you either have a girlfriend, or are not interested in her. You absolutely have to be a bit of a touchy feely guy.

Touchy feeling + eye contact....hmmm, you know, I do touch...but maybe not often enough? And eye contact, well, I tend to look at the group a lot when talking, but that's interesting...

Just one thing...is it wise to let her know you're interested with eye contact? Or maybe I could do eye contact but also ignore her somehow, as to show her I'm interested but don't really care? Is that even a good idea?


Ya might also want to make use of an SOI (one of Jugglers things) It's a statement of interest/intent eg. Wow not only are you sexy you're a good conversationalist.

You know...it won't hurt to try that

Thank you guys so much

Fervour
09-17-2008, 01:12 AM
Touchy feeling + eye contact....hmmm, you know, I do touch...but maybe not often enough? And eye contact, well, I tend to look at the group a lot when talking, but that's interesting...

Just one thing...is it wise to let her know you're interested with eye contact? Or maybe I could do eye contact but also ignore her somehow, as to show her I'm interested but don't really care? Is that even a good idea?

Kino can be a hard thing to get into. I know I'm naturally very cautious about touching girls in any way, because I'd hate to give off that 'creepy' vibe. But there are subtle ways of making physical contact with her that's just normal after a certain amount of interaction has taken place and she's comfortable with you. You can start off with things like playfully punching or slapping her arm if she says something cheeky, or giving her a high five if she's said something worthy of it.

And later on when you've isolated her, things like sitting closely next to her with your bodies/legs touching all counts. It shows she's comfortable with you and lets you know you can move further. You can then do some fake palm reading excercise with her, play red hands (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Hands) with her, and whatever. Then kiss her when the moment's right. Mystery's kiss-close routine's a classic. Or do whatever you're comfortable with.

With eye contact... Hold eye contact with everyone in the group. Hold eye contact with you target while addressing the group, then turn slightly to another in the group while continuing to talk and hold eye contact, then the next, etc, and alternate. With your target you could avoid looking at her at all, unless she actually speaks. Just make sure it doesn't look robotic. This is when it can be difficult. I can't remember the acronym or term for this, put it's like passively negging the target. Giving attention to her friends, while seemingly not her. You have to be careful and 'microcalibrate' though. You don't want to turn into an asshole, as you put it before. Eye contact is a mini IOI on your behalf, but only give it to your target when she has IOI'd you. Eye contact with sets shows a lot of control, and confidence.